Halibut-Closing on the 9th

Again like last year let us have strong solidarity amongst the sport fishing community to boycott this misguided and unworkable program!!!

Category(s):
RECREATIONAL - General Information,
RECREATIONAL - Fin Fish (Other than Salmon)



Fishery Notice - Fisheries and Oceans Canada

Subject: FN0803-Halibut Experimental Recreational Fishery Program

Fishing for recreational halibut may continue to occur for those interested in
participating in the experimental recreational fishery. The pilot fishy began
in 2011; on February 17, 2012, the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans announced
that the experimental recreational halibut fishery program would continue
throughout the 2012 season.

For details on the experimental fishery please visit: http://www.pac.dfo-
mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/index-eng.htm.

The program will be available to interested participants until the end of
December.

For more information contact:
Chantelle Caron 604-666-0912 or Devona Adams 604-666-3271

 
If guides would have known they were going to have a shortened season and not told that there would NEVER be any in season closures they probably would have applied for some quota, much little the Rec guys would have. As for handing in your license every year. Why not? I don't hand in my DFO log book till the end of the season. If you don't hand in your license you don't get one for the next year.

There are many ways DFO can make this work, they just need to come up with something solid that we all have to follow instead of asking for favors and then doing their voodo math because they have no data. I don't have the answers but there has to be a way to collect reasonable data that they use that we are happy with.
 
There are ways to do this now, however as noted the guides are not on side.
If they could get there **** together and work with the SFAB then they could solve a lot of what is referred to as voodoo math.

Over to you guides!




If guides would have known they were going to have a shortened season and not told that there would NEVER be any in season closures they probably would have applied for some quota, much little the Rec guys would have. As for handing in your license every year. Why not? I don't hand in my DFO log book till the end of the season. If you don't hand in your license you don't get one for the next year.

There are many ways DFO can make this work, they just need to come up with something solid that we all have to follow instead of asking for favors and then doing their voodo math because they have no data. I don't have the answers but there has to be a way to collect reasonable data that they use that we are happy with.
 
Again, until it is mandatory it's not going to happen. Those of us that do hand in our books are working towards a better good. This isn't just about guides and lodges, there is a lot of rec fishers that fish our coast and catch ALOT of halibut. How is that being recorded? Please don't say creel surveys cause they are a joke. DFO needs a system that covers all halibut that comes out of the water, doesn't matter who catches it. That's why we ALL need to work on this. It's not up to the guides, it's up to all of us. I worry if the guides and lodges go out on their own the rec sector could be in trouble. There is a lot of high powered lodge owners with alot of pull and if they had to fend for themselves the rest of us might be left behind.

Again, this is a TAC problem, bottom line our sector needs more. That should still be our focus, as it was last year and we got back 3%, couple more years and we could be up over 20%.
 
The solution is quite simple. Take the license revenue out of G.R. and put license fees up!!! Only if it is taken out of G.R. though. Annual resident should then be $100, no brake for seniors, one day resident $15, annual non resident $300, non res day license $20 then create an annual charter license $500 per boat. There is the extra revenue to pay for the added data collection and then some.
 
Ok, we know the percentage breakdowns, so again guides need to buck up.
Guides and lodges cannot go alone as this would be politically a big mistake.
Again back to the SFAB as this is what the government set up to work with sports fisherman
All the other groups work within this group.

Again, until it is mandatory it's not going to happen. Those of us that do hand in our books are working towards a better good. This isn't just about guides and lodges, there is a lot of rec fishers that fish our coast and catch ALOT of halibut. How is that being recorded? Please don't say creel surveys cause they are a joke. DFO needs a system that covers all halibut that comes out of the water, doesn't matter who catches it. That's why we ALL need to work on this. It's not up to the guides, it's up to all of us. I worry if the guides and lodges go out on their own the rec sector could be in trouble. There is a lot of high powered lodge owners with alot of pull and if they had to fend for themselves the rest of us might be left behind.

Again, this is a TAC problem, bottom line our sector needs more. That should still be our focus, as it was last year and we got back 3%, couple more years and we could be up over 20%.
 
Raising the licence fees is great but bottom line is we shouldn't have to buy more quota. So why raise license costs? Tired of arguing this point, it is irrelevant who is catching this fish, the monitoring of it is what needs to change. That or more TAC and it's not a problem.
 
The increased license fees would be fofr data collection, increased hatchery production...anything that helps DFO better mange and also puts more fish back into the ocean. With this objective how could anyone ask why put up license fees? Should someone running a farm in Sask pay for this or those who benefit directly from this gift of a resource?
 
Interesting that as a guide you want information on catches made public.
Well it would be great if the guides turned in their catch statistics for a start!
You should ask them why they do not do this?

As for the stats this information is available to the Halibut Group of the SFAB and if you were really interested you could get involved with them.

The people involved on behalf of the Halibut Group of the SFAB spend days working for free for your benefit.
You and others could step up and get involved in the SFAB process.
You would find out that a lot of these thoughts have been discussed and answers given.

Do you see the commercial sector talking about plans on a public site?
They love it when you do as they use it in their meetings and use it to stir up the pot.
They never will just like they do not invite you to their meetings. It is all about money.

They play hard ball as this is their living. It appears guides have a lot to learn on that front going by the stuff written on this and other sites.

Well Gerry I'm sad to read your response. It would appear to me you are doing a good job working to divide the recreational community along lines of guides and non guides. Boy if I didn't think differently I would suspect you might be working for the other team...For the record:

1. I do have a log book, and I was involved in our Guide Association to promote the use of log books through the SFI, and many guides are participating once they know or have been asked to participate in the program. Sad to see such uninformed comments about the many guides who actively participate. I worry those comments were intentionally aimed at dividing the recreational fishing community.
2. I and other guides are involved in the SFAC and when asked the SFAB process, not to mention other organizations including in my case helping to organize the Oceanside PSF Dinner and Auction for the past 7 years running. I guess as a guide it is automatic that we simply take from the resource without giving a damn about putting something back....I wonder what would happen to many charitable organizations fund raising and the SFAB process if we acted as a group in the same manner in which some would brand us. Side note - Funny, I don't recall seeing you at the SFAB meetings.
3. Not all the information and catch statistics are or were shared at the SFAC and SFAB process, you were involved so you would know that. Only certain insiders got the full deck of information. So when guys on this site who are not able to be involved in the SFAC processes say its an old boys club, and information is locked up in a vault, to them that is true. All I am saying is the process needs to be much more transparent = public. Moreover, you may also recall that there was a motion passed at the SFAB Main Board asking for increased transparency - I support that, are you suggesting we continue the old boys club?
4. If you read my past posts, I have actively promoted folks get involved in the process "if" they can - but I also recognize not everyone is able. I know guys who cannot, but that does not mean they are any less interested, nor are their views and ability to participate any less important.
5. I'm also questioning why we allow folks to set up SFAC meetings on week days during normal work hours which makes the process virtually impossible for normal working Joe's who might be interested in Area 17 to participate...for the record that only serves to promote an old boys club within the SFAC. We need greater transparency in all levels of the process.
6. Last point, and on this we agree...not always a good idea to post our ideas on a site like this...the opposition is watching. But in some cases, where our strategy is well known and is already public for the past 3 years, it really doesn't matter at this point in time...so hopefully the rest of the angling public can better understand the issues and where their support might actually make a difference in our long term future access to this fishery....or would you rather we continue the old boys club.
 
This is not about dividing groups, this is about people who were asked to fill in log books as you were. As you are involved in a guide association you know there are a lot who did not fill them out.
This has been going on for a while, so again we need the information, why is it not being sent in?

Glad to see you go to the SFAB meetings. The information you want is available, you have to ask for it or sit on the committee involved.
This is not an old boys group, this is a who shows up and get involves group.
You do not think it works well, then get involved and change it.

Meeting times for the sfac are set up by the chairs in discussion with members. I am not a chair so do not set up times.
The area I am in meets in the days and as well as has night meetings. FYI, there were more people involved in the day meetings.
Again, do not like the way it is run then get involved. Whining about it is an old boys club yet doing nothing says everything.
People get involved because it effects them or they care. They can always find time for a few meetings.
If it effects there lively hood I would think they would be involved in a real way.

Now let's see how the court case goes that the commercial sector has.
By the way i have gone to all the meetings our sfac has.






QUOTE=searun;252067]Well Gerry I'm sad to read your response. It would appear to me you are doing a good jo
b working to divide the recreational community along lines of guides and non guides. Boy if I didn't think differently I would suspect you might be working for the other team...For the record:

1. I do have a log book, and I was involved in our Guide Association to promote the use of log books through the SFI, and many guides are participating once they know or have been asked to participate in the program. Sad to see such uninformed comments about the many guides who actively participate. I worry those comments were intentionally aimed at dividing the recreational fishing community.
2. I and other guides are involved in the SFAC and when asked the SFAB process, not to mention other organizations including in my case helping to organize the Oceanside PSF Dinner and Auction for the past 7 years running. I guess as a guide it is automatic that we simply take from the resource without giving a damn about putting something back....I wonder what would happen to many charitable organizations fund raising and the SFAB process if we acted as a group in the same manner in which some would brand us. Side note - Funny, I don't recall seeing you at the SFAB meetings.
3. Not all the information and catch statistics are or were shared at the SFAC and SFAB process, you were involved so you would know that. Only certain insiders got the full deck of information. So when guys on this site who are not able to be involved in the SFAC processes say its an old boys club, and information is locked up in a vault, to them that is true. All I am saying is the process needs to be much more transparent = public. Moreover, you may also recall that there was a motion passed at the SFAB Main Board asking for increased transparency - I support that, are you suggesting we continue the old boys club?
4. If you read my past posts, I have actively promoted folks get involved in the process "if" they can - but I also recognize not everyone is able. I know guys who cannot, but that does not mean they are any less interested, nor are their views and ability to participate any less important.
5. I'm also questioning why we allow folks to set up SFAC meetings on week days during normal work hours which makes the process virtually impossible for normal working Joe's who might be interested in Area 17 to participate...for the record that only serves to promote an old boys club within the SFAC. We need greater transparency in all levels of the process.
6. Last point, and on this we agree...not always a good idea to post our ideas on a site like this...the opposition is watching. But in some cases, where our strategy is well known and is already public for the past 3 years, it really doesn't matter at this point in time...so hopefully the rest of the angling public can better understand the issues and where their support might actually make a difference in our long term future access to this fishery....or would you rather we continue the old boys club.[/QUOTE]
 
no halibut was gifted to our family we purhased most of it for 26$ a pound; you have taken 3% away this cost us many dollers as well hinders our attemp to keep off the welfare rolls; salmon is or was so missmanaged we has to get into halibut; my son says he dosnt mind letting you take a little more if we can be compensated for it; let the govt pay us to rectify there mismanagement and then ask for more quota; maybe less trouble and results that way;
 
when i go deer hunting i have to a buy tags as well as a licence this could perhaps slow the fishery down a bit and make it last a bit longer
 
buying quota from the commies is the worst thing we could do...i dont think buying a tag for halibut would extend our season...We would just be giving them more money that does not go back into conservation..How do they estimate our target catch? Is it by guide reports and creel surveys? How do we come up with an accurate number on catch stats? Its getting worse and worse, not better, years of mismanagment of salmon and halibut r catching up with us, paying more money to fish will not bring back the stocks we once had. If i seen dfo putting money into hatcheries and conservation id gladly pay for a tag..
 
buying quota from the commies is the worst thing we could do...i dont think buying a tag for halibut would extend our season...We would just be giving them more money that does not go back into conservation...

You may want to read up on how the ITQ system works. This isn't about conservation. The IPHC sets the available TAC based on a conservative estimate of the harvestable catch, then it is divided up between Rec and Commercial sectors. Securing more TAC by whatever means is what is necessary to secure the long term future of our fishery. We might not like the system and how it was gifted to the commercial sector, but we still have to deal with it.:(
 
when i go deer hunting i have to a buy tags as well as a licence this could perhaps slow the fishery down a bit and make it last a bit longer
How would this work, every recreational allowed to buy 10 tags for $260 and they are good for life? if they don't want to use them they can sell them?
 
How would this work, every recreational allowed to buy 10 tags for $260 and they are good for life? if they don't want to use them they can sell them?
So lets take that idea to the next step.
$260 for 10 halibut.......
$260 for 10 springs
$260 for 10 Coho
$260 for 10 pinks
$260 for 10 Sockeye
Would that work?
AND DON'T FORGET THE HST!
 
You missed the point, it's a one time purchase like the commercial quota that if you don't want to use you can sell it, bequeath it to your kids etc. It would be a heck of a deal!Once you've got it the only way you can lose it is to sell it, or be compensated if the government reallocates . Lets call it a personal transferrable quota. So using the Commercial model as I understand it,I decide I don't want to fish one year, I sell you my quota for that year, for example, at $260 plus whatever the market will bear (made my initial investment back plus a profit in this scenario), because there are no more tags and you want more than ten fish. The next year and all following years I simply pay for a license because I have my already paid for tags and those of my children to be re issued every year.
 
no ideotic comments will solve ypur problems; put one of your tags on each halibut you catch; when they are used up your freezer should be full; so then go salmon fishing; till your sporting instincts are satisifyed; that alone will lenghten the season; put your brains to work; get after your govtment to question the pollock fisheries in alaska where millions of lbs of small halibut are caught and wasted in trawl fisheries; if this was stopped total allowable catch would rise and your season would be much lenthened; google tholepin and read ebout it
 
Buy personal quota is a bad idea.
We would be confirming to the government that we agree with their plan to privatize a Canadian resource.
The idea that this natural resource is owned by the public goes back to Greek and Roman times.
It was reaffirmed in the Magna-Carta and the BNA act.
To fall for the argument that the only way to "save" the resource is to privatize it is BS.
The "tragedy of the commons" argument is about commercial use of a public resource not personal use.
That's a big difference and should always be remembered when dealing with the bean counters.

We go down this road and we would see future family's that have "rights" to halibut.
If you are not part of this select group then you would not be allowed to catch halibut.
Sound familiar?
How fair is that to future generations?

Sorry I don't want that kind of future for my country.
What's next, water?
GLG

Not one pound of halibut should leave this country until all Canadians needs are met.
 
Buy personal quota is a bad idea.
We would be confirming to the government that we agree with their plan to privatize a Canadian resource.
The idea that this natural resource is owned by the public goes back to Greek and Roman times.
It was reaffirmed in the Magna-Carta and the BNA act.
To fall for the argument that the only way to "save" the resource is to privatize it is BS.
The "tragedy of the commons" argument is about commercial use of a public resource not personal use.
That's a big difference and should always be remembered when dealing with the bean counters.

We go down this road and we would see future family's that have "rights" to halibut.
If you are not part of this select group then you would not be allowed to catch halibut.
Sound familiar?
How fair is that to future generations?

Sorry I don't want that kind of future for my country.
What's next, water?
GLG

Not one pound of halibut should leave this country until all Canadians needs are met.

X2
What he said!!!!!
 
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