Aquaculture improving?..The Fish Farm Thread

[wildmanyeah]

Interesting narrative promoted by the industry PR firms and boosters: anyone looking for accountability from either the industry or their compromised regulators - DFO- gets labelled an "anti" verses instead of simply being opposed to impacts to wild stocks vis-a-vis the very open net-cage technology used by the industry which allows them to currently operate with free pumping, free waster disposal and nearly free real estate and thereby maximizing their profits by offloading and externalizing impacts.

you obviously didn't watch the youtube video i posted that he was talking about.

or maybe yours talking about cuttlefishes post? thinking he was commenting on that.

narrative promoted by the industry PR firms and boosters:

also interesting that you get upset about the label anti, only to use your own labels like boosters.

 

[Hardy Guy]

That was my point WMY, it was directed at your video. Now there are protests against closed containment, GMO etc. Closed containment uses too much water and uses too much energy (as stated all along by fish farming companies). Seems like the commercial fishermen don't like closed containment, GMO fish, water use or energy use. I guess they do not eat : corn, wheat, canola, fruits, vegetables ...................... the list goes on.

 

[wildmanyeah]

That was my point WMY, it was directed at your video. Now there are protests against closed containment, GMO etc. Closed containment uses too much water and uses too much energy (as stated all along by fish farming companies). Seems like the commercial fishermen don't like closed containment, GMO fish, water use or energy use. I guess they do not eat : corn, wheat, canola, fruits, vegetables ...................... the list goes on.

This is nothing new, Alaska opposition and money was against our fish farms not because they kill wild salmon but because they bring down Alaska wild salmon prices. That's where the whole eat wild salmon campaign came from.

No surprise that we see Alaskan First Nations, Commercial Fishermen and politicians trying to stop them.

 

[agentaqua]

Canada Fisheries Minister's transition plan could take mandate to move salmon farms to closed-containment systems off the table | Intrafish

Murray said transitioning to closed containment systems is no longer part of her mandate.

www.intrafish.com

 

[wildmanyeah]

Canada Fisheries Minister's transition plan could take mandate to move salmon farms to closed-containment systems off the table | Intrafish

Murray said transitioning to closed containment systems is no longer part of her mandate.

www.intrafish.com

Is she still the fisheries minister?

 

[wildmanyeah]

new DM looks like

Annette Gibbons, currently Associate Deputy Minister of Employment and Social Development, becomes Deputy Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, effective October 31, 2022.

 

[SpringFever552]

This is nothing new, Alaska opposition and money was against our fish farms not because they kill wild salmon but because they bring down Alaska "RANCHED" salmon prices. That's where the whole eat wild "CAUGHT" salmon campaign came from.

No surprise that we see Alaskan First Nations, Commercial Fishermen and politicians trying to stop them.

Fixed your post

 

[terrin]

I don't see or hear any Conservative Politician advocating for removal of Open Net Cage Fish Farms either. In this two party system that means the Wild Fish are screwed unless the First Nation's want them removed which is likely the only hope.

 

[Hardy Guy]

But Terrin what if FN want them and are asking to keep them ? ............................ then what does the Gov. do ? Really good returns on the rivers from Campbell North on the island. I hear West Coast Rivers doing OK also.

 

[ship happens]

I was under the impression that some FN groups get paid. Some don't. Am I correct?

 

[Hardy Guy]

For sure some have benefit agreements but they are often more than just getting paid. Several Nations have also invested in different types of vessels and other gear and infrastructure. Some Nations have the farm land tenures in their Name so they would be considered partners. Its not uncommon for people in an area to benefit from industries that may be operating in the area. There are lots of industries that impact the Fraser River that do not benefit Nations on the Coast.

 

[terrin]

But Terrin what if FN want them and are asking to keep them ? ............................ then what does the Gov. do ? Really good returns on the rivers from Campbell North on the island. I hear West Coast Rivers doing OK also.

Are you talking about all or even most individual First Nation people collectively or an elected chief under the Indian Act turning a quick buck while they sit in the Big Chair?

 

[terrin]

Are you talking about all or even most individual First Nation people collectively or an elected chief under the Indian Act turning a quick buck while they sit in the Big Chair?

If it’s the former, in this day and age I’m sure they would have organized a protest to continue with the Open Net Cage Fish Farms and the handful of jobs they get from them but I haven’t seen that.

 

[ship happens]

If they are basically leasing out the water leases, then it's up to the feds unless it's sanctioned as a BC land and mines managed area as to who make the permits acclipabke to the business use for the water lot. If first nations can do what they wish without having to deal with the permits then the lease would have to still be applied to the business that leased the water lot at that point.

 

[SpringFever552]

Are you talking about all or even most individual First Nation people collectively or an elected chief under the Indian Act turning a quick buck while they sit in the Big Chair?

You asked...

https://bcsalmonfarmers.ca/first-nations/

BC First Nation: We will manage fish farming and fisheries on our land ‘with or without the Canadian government’ - Aquaculture North America

Two Indigenous peoples in British Columbia today (25 March) re-asserted their authority over their territories “with or without the Canadian Government,”

www.aquaculturenorthamerica.com

 

[Hardy Guy]

Are you talking about all or even most individual First Nation people collectively or an elected chief under the Indian Act turning a quick buck while they sit in the Big Chair?

Aren't elected people supposed to represent the people that elected them ? Sort of how elected government works. Most FN communities have numerous people elected with a fairly small population so one would think they need to represent the voters. I'm not sure what you are implying ..................... elected Chief and counsel are all corrupt unless they agree with anti fish farm folks ??

 

[wildmanyeah]

Coalition of First Nations for Finfish Stewardship thanks fisheries minister for consultations

Dallas Smith, spokesperson for the Coalition, wrote a letter to Murray extending his gratitude

www.northislandgazette.com

Smith noted that during Murray’s visit, she heard from more than a dozen hereditary and elected chiefs who are “fighting for their inherent right to host finfish farming as they see fit in their traditional marine spaces. The chiefs voiced their thoughts, concerns, and input regarding your ministry’s current engagement process for the transition away from open-net pen aquaculture in their waters.”

He added that although the chiefs working with the Coalition represent many diverse and unique communities, “they are united by their shared priorities of protecting wild salmon and asserting their self-determination, stewardship, rights, and title regarding finfish farming. It was critical to the chiefs that these values were strongly portrayed to you concerning finfish aquaculture operating in their territories. Also relayed to you was how it is your ministry’s responsibility to carry out the transition of farms in their waters in a way that respects those same values.”

1. That the aim of her visit was to discuss next steps in the transitioning of the finfish aquaculture sector with nations who have an interest in the sector and to ask what can make this transition plan a successful one from their perspectives;



2. The approach is to develop a framework for that transition, not a plan, by 2023;

3. Existing operations need to adopt alternative technology that will progressively eliminate or minimize interactions between wild and farmed salmon;

4. The decision regarding farms in the territories of the Laich-kwil-tach and Klahoose First Nations (referred to by DFO as the Discovery Islands) lacked adequate process in the decisions made by the previous fisheries minister; however, Murray considers the area a subset of DFO’s broader mandate and she maintains the previous minister’s decision while carrying out consultation with various communities;

5. That Murray respects traditional Indigenous knowledge and science as part of the consideration on how to manage wild salmon in our territories;

6. That Murray has admiration for the partnerships the nations have formed with finfish farming companies and now see how the sector has a strong respect for the nations’ input in their operations;



7. That Murray recognizes a lot has been done by the sector to improve since her involvement in the industry 18 years ago, but that there’s more to do, and this transition is about developing a plan to map out what further improvement will look like; and

8. Canada needs a framework and approach to this transition that challenges yet supports the industry in making improvements to protect wild salmon.

 

[terrin]

Aren't elected people supposed to represent the people that elected them ? Sort of how elected government works. Most FN communities have numerous people elected with a fairly small population so one would think they need to represent the voters. I'm not sure what you are implying ..................... elected Chief and counsel are all corrupt unless they agree with anti fish farm folks

Coalition of First Nations for Finfish Stewardship thanks fisheries minister for consultations

Dallas Smith, spokesperson for the Coalition, wrote a letter to Murray extending his gratitude

www.northislandgazette.com

Smith noted that during Murray’s visit, she heard from more than a dozen hereditary and elected chiefs who are “fighting for their inherent right to host finfish farming as they see fit in their traditional marine spaces. The chiefs voiced their thoughts, concerns, and input regarding your ministry’s current engagement process for the transition away from open-net pen aquaculture in their waters.”

He added that although the chiefs working with the Coalition represent many diverse and unique communities, “they are united by their shared priorities of protecting wild salmon and asserting their self-determination, stewardship, rights, and title regarding finfish farming. It was critical to the chiefs that these values were strongly portrayed to you concerning finfish aquaculture operating in their territories. Also relayed to you was how it is your ministry’s responsibility to carry out the transition of farms in their waters in a way that respects those same values.”

1. That the aim of her visit was to discuss next steps in the transitioning of the finfish aquaculture sector with nations who have an interest in the sector and to ask what can make this transition plan a successful one from their perspectives;



2. The approach is to develop a framework for that transition, not a plan, by 2023;

3. Existing operations need to adopt alternative technology that will progressively eliminate or minimize interactions between wild and farmed salmon;

4. The decision regarding farms in the territories of the Laich-kwil-tach and Klahoose First Nations (referred to by DFO as the Discovery Islands) lacked adequate process in the decisions made by the previous fisheries minister; however, Murray considers the area a subset of DFO’s broader mandate and she maintains the previous minister’s decision while carrying out consultation with various communities;

5. That Murray respects traditional Indigenous knowledge and science as part of the consideration on how to manage wild salmon in our territories;

6. That Murray has admiration for the partnerships the nations have formed with finfish farming companies and now see how the sector has a strong respect for the nations’ input in their operations;



7. That Murray recognizes a lot has been done by the sector to improve since her involvement in the industry 18 years ago, but that there’s more to do, and this transition is about developing a plan to map out what further improvement will look like; and

8. Canada needs a framework and approach to this transition that challenges yet supports the industry in making improvements to protect wild salmon.

Ruby Manila, a member of the Da’naxda’xw First Nation, said three of four Da’naxda’xw hereditary chiefs were not notified of the application.

“I would have expected at least the Tlowitsis to reach out to all First Nations who this would affect, to tell them they were making an application — and instead we’re sort of finding out things are happening without consultation,” she said. “We have a right to know what’s going on within our own territories.”

The application has the potential to affect all Kwakwaka’wakw people who use the area for fishing, she said.

Andrew Wadhams, a Ma’amtagila hereditary chief, also said several hereditary leaders had not been contacted.


“I took my time out yesterday to contact all the hereditary chiefs of the Ma’amtagila, along with all the hereditary chiefs of the Tlowitsis, and a lot of the membership, and not one of them was ever consulted about the fish farm,” he said.

Brian Wadhams, another hereditary Ma’amtagila chief and former ‘Namgis First Nation councillor, said it is important for Tlowitsis Nation to negotiate with all surrounding Nations.

“What disturbs us the most is that we fought for 30 years to remove farms from the Broughton Archipelago, and here we are going back to the same old, same old,” he said. “It’s really frustrating for us as First Nations people that rely on those areas for food sustenance and our food security needs.”

 

[terrin]

Ruby Manila, a member of the Da’naxda’xw First Nation, said three of four Da’naxda’xw hereditary chiefs were not notified of the application.

“I would have expected at least the Tlowitsis to reach out to all First Nations who this would affect, to tell them they were making an application — and instead we’re sort of finding out things are happening without consultation,” she said. “We have a right to know what’s going on within our own territories.”

The application has the potential to affect all Kwakwaka’wakw people who use the area for fishing, she said.

Andrew Wadhams, a Ma’amtagila hereditary chief, also said several hereditary leaders had not been contacted.


“I took my time out yesterday to contact all the hereditary chiefs of the Ma’amtagila, along with all the hereditary chiefs of the Tlowitsis, and a lot of the membership, and not one of them was ever consulted about the fish farm,” he said.

Brian Wadhams, another hereditary Ma’amtagila chief and former ‘Namgis First Nation councillor, said it is important for Tlowitsis Nation to negotiate with all surrounding Nations.

“What disturbs us the most is that we fought for 30 years to remove farms from the Broughton Archipelago, and here we are going back to the same old, same old,” he said. “It’s really frustrating for us as First Nations people that rely on those areas for food sustenance and our food security needs.”

 

[wildmanyeah]

Perhaps terrin since you seem to be very knowledgeable indigenous affairs you can explain to us what it means to be hereditary chief and their powers are in their community’s. Especially the ones you have referred to above.

Andrew Wadhams, a Ma’amtagila hereditary chief,????????

Brian Wadhams, another hereditary Ma’amtagila chief?????