Southeast Alaska is shutting down their chinook fisheries...gulp
- Thread starter gamechanger
- Start date
Here is the link to the Pacific Salmon Treaty:
http://www.psc.org/publications/pacific-salmon-treaty/
It will download a PDF doc to your computer
On page 90 is a table describing a list of Salmon stocks that the SEAK fisheries are under obligation to protect. Might be that only shutting down SEAK was sufficient to protect whatever needed protecting.
Other Chinook related info begins on page 57.
http://www.psc.org/publications/pacific-salmon-treaty/
It will download a PDF doc to your computer
On page 90 is a table describing a list of Salmon stocks that the SEAK fisheries are under obligation to protect. Might be that only shutting down SEAK was sufficient to protect whatever needed protecting.
Other Chinook related info begins on page 57.
SpringVelocity
Crew Member
Second that.
SpringVelocity
Crew Member
Good for you. I am watching this thread from different eyes. Myself and others that are on these thread give our money and also volunteer free hours to get a number of things done from hatcheries to raising money into enhancement. Derby on others spend countless hours on other fronts talking about issues like this behind doors face to face. From my perspective we all know the US has crucified a lot of migrating fish here. Many times when we all knew how things were they still fished there runs hard. Maybe instead of taking this as a bad we see this as what not to do. As for closing our fishery it wont happen. I find we as a group are pretty engaged with DFO. I do agree restrictions could be possible the same thing wouldn't happen here. If you want some advise I would unplug from forum and see how you can get involved.
The US over-harvested when they should have conserved years ago. We did it sooner. A coast wide closer would be devastating to remote island communities, and I dont believe the government would really want that.
Here's some more food for thought...
Currently a resident saltwater licence is a mere $28 or something. The most recent stats I could fine was a number from 2005, 275,000 saltwater licences sold. At the same number = a whopping $7.7 Million. What will you get done with that? Obviously enhancement efforts are gonna eat up a lot more than that, federal taxpayer money always helps, but if the sportsmen could pay a little more...
What is the priveledge to fish salmon, halibut and such worth to you? At $100 per licence we would now have $27.5 Million.
$200 per licence = $55 million
How 'bout the even sum of $250 per licence per year... would be $68.75 Million
So my suggestion... up the licence to what it is worth and up the enhancement as well as the opportunity. If the sportfishers pay the bill the sportfishers gain the benefit. Likewise the commercials, even fist nations... pay and reap. No pay, continue with your basic right but nothing more. That would be fish for you, your kids, and your dawg, even some to dump back in the harbour next year but no selling.
With the pressures mounting on the resource, hatcheries in abundance please??? They work.
Currently a resident saltwater licence is a mere $28 or something. The most recent stats I could fine was a number from 2005, 275,000 saltwater licences sold. At the same number = a whopping $7.7 Million. What will you get done with that? Obviously enhancement efforts are gonna eat up a lot more than that, federal taxpayer money always helps, but if the sportsmen could pay a little more...
What is the priveledge to fish salmon, halibut and such worth to you? At $100 per licence we would now have $27.5 Million.
$200 per licence = $55 million
How 'bout the even sum of $250 per licence per year... would be $68.75 Million
So my suggestion... up the licence to what it is worth and up the enhancement as well as the opportunity. If the sportfishers pay the bill the sportfishers gain the benefit. Likewise the commercials, even fist nations... pay and reap. No pay, continue with your basic right but nothing more. That would be fish for you, your kids, and your dawg, even some to dump back in the harbour next year but no selling.
With the pressures mounting on the resource, hatcheries in abundance please??? They work.
ryanb
Well-Known Member
Hatcheries are like putting a Band-Aid on a wound that needs stitches. Sure it might stop the bleeding but it definitely isn't going to help the wild fish recover.
salmon slayer
Active Member
There is no doubt in my Ming that people coming from other countries should be pay considerably more than what they do today. People that live in bc should pay the least and people from other parts of Canada should pay more than people in bc
SpringVelocity
Crew Member
Yes and no. While a agree long term solutions are wild fish if you look around that would take years and millions of dollars to just make wild fish come back.
Also a lot of what people think our wild fish are from hatcheries they are just not missing adipose fin.
Three things are needed. Hatchery production, stream enhancement, and for the bc and federal government to protect salmon habitat. The third one is key. That is the one that people seem to not be interested in. We are good at saving fish in ocean but then when industry pollutes crap out of stream and rivers we turn all our heads away because we want jobs. What good is it too protect fish just to have offspring not survive?
Where is the trudeau government promise to empower Dfo and environment canada to act when industry pollutes and kills our fish?
Sorry we are getting off topic here....
Dave H
Well-Known Member
Yesterday I talked with my buddy who looks after a lot of the freight for the lodges from the Masset airport and asked about the season up there so far.
He said it started slow with smaller fish than normal, was somewhat spotty but recently he'd heard of a few bigger fish. Not good at all this year.
Just as an aside as it's different today but in 1990 I did a survey near the end of June and compared the Langara Island area lodges catch with the 10 day commercial troll opening that had just finished in the same area.
May and June catch logged at the lodges operating then came to around 3600 Chinook.
The 10 day commercial opening ended up with over 60,000 pieces landed by roughly 400 commercial trollers.
Outdated info but a look back at who caught the most fish then.
Funny how the Haida protested the lodges catching all "their" salmon when it was the commercial fleet that was catching thousands more than the lodges were.......again.....back then.
Take care.
Aces
Well-Known Member
kaelc
Crew Member
I think number of licenses that will be bought will drop if the price jumps significantly, plus even the effort of the government making and communicating such a decision would take up millions of dollars. I think we just need to argue for more of our already paid tax, all rec fishers boating expenditatures and tourism raised dollars, thanks to guides, to go into fisheries and not pet government projects.
The 2nd part is sad but true...
The pace of destruction in recent years has gone beyond the level that prevails recovery...
It's horrible, can you imagine if we didn't have cell phones, this forum, fish finders, high speed downriggers, 20 lb balls etc. like the old days?The 2nd part is sad but true...
The pace of destruction in recent years has gone beyond the level that prevails recovery...
$250 for a licence might seem steep to people who have been getting their licences for essentially nothing, truly $28 is like getting a licence for free. What's a $100? Its nothing, pocket change, a nice supper in a decent restaurant without drinks. $200 is going out for supper twice without drinks. A couple tanks of fuel in your truck, again virtually nothing much. I vote we invest heavily in our resource and ensure it doesn't just limp along, but flourishes so that it's better than the old days. I believe it to be optional.
Next alongside investing, we must protect our interest. Again some more money. A heavy handed legal defense fund, a powerful lobby group. This is what it takes to get it done. We need somebody to fight for us that the government will listen to, in a manner that commands the respect of our billion dollar contribution to this country. We already have a billion in it, we simply need to make it work for us. We need a strong voice to throw the weight behind it. We have the weight but don't use it.
Hatcheries? Most certainly. More scientific study and action, of course. Hatcheries are branded as a band aid, a negative by some but makes zero sense. Wild fish captured and their eggs fertilized to the max instead of the small percentage that nature allows, eggs/smolts back in the same water that the wild fish came from. What's the difference? Nothing. except way more fish.
Study the ocean etc... why aren't our fish flourishing, oh wait, we are pillaging this resource or that and our salmon need it instead of somebody making pocket change. Lets continue protecting the stocks and our billion dollars we already have in. Some industry polluting our streams, we take our other $50 million legal defense fund and shut them down. Don't/can't wait for the government to act because they enable these people. We lay way too much responsibility on our government or should I say dependence when all along they aren't interested in acting for us because they have their industry favored agendas. Serious money in the court will win. This is what it will take to fix it. Lets fix it instead of sitting on the internet complaining and arguing with each other and accomplishing little. It's just money.
Perhaps the government will give us the sportfishers back our halibut that they simply took away and awarded to the commercials. I would much rather give the government a $20, even $50 tag for a flatty and "buy " fish from the government than pay how much a pound to some commercial that the government awarded a ridiculous unfair system of which the recipients did nothing to deserve. $100 halibut licence and we get our limit back without the silly size limits, maybe the same with salmon? and the children can fish perch of the dock for a child rate. Oh... $250 too much to fish salmon and halibut? Sure! stay home then! Awesome!!! Fixing all the broken stuff, the people that don't care about the resource can stay home and buy a couple cases of beer with their horded pocket change, drink it and then whiz it away on the ground... as they would be standing on land, not the back of a fishing boat!
I'm not rich, by no means, hope to be able to afford my first boat soon but not for certain. But I am willing to do what it takes. Anybody else or am I just a nut and stand alone, and better to horde your money and take whatever scraps the govt throws our way as they restrict more and more?
Next alongside investing, we must protect our interest. Again some more money. A heavy handed legal defense fund, a powerful lobby group. This is what it takes to get it done. We need somebody to fight for us that the government will listen to, in a manner that commands the respect of our billion dollar contribution to this country. We already have a billion in it, we simply need to make it work for us. We need a strong voice to throw the weight behind it. We have the weight but don't use it.
Hatcheries? Most certainly. More scientific study and action, of course. Hatcheries are branded as a band aid, a negative by some but makes zero sense. Wild fish captured and their eggs fertilized to the max instead of the small percentage that nature allows, eggs/smolts back in the same water that the wild fish came from. What's the difference? Nothing. except way more fish.
Study the ocean etc... why aren't our fish flourishing, oh wait, we are pillaging this resource or that and our salmon need it instead of somebody making pocket change. Lets continue protecting the stocks and our billion dollars we already have in. Some industry polluting our streams, we take our other $50 million legal defense fund and shut them down. Don't/can't wait for the government to act because they enable these people. We lay way too much responsibility on our government or should I say dependence when all along they aren't interested in acting for us because they have their industry favored agendas. Serious money in the court will win. This is what it will take to fix it. Lets fix it instead of sitting on the internet complaining and arguing with each other and accomplishing little. It's just money.
Perhaps the government will give us the sportfishers back our halibut that they simply took away and awarded to the commercials. I would much rather give the government a $20, even $50 tag for a flatty and "buy " fish from the government than pay how much a pound to some commercial that the government awarded a ridiculous unfair system of which the recipients did nothing to deserve. $100 halibut licence and we get our limit back without the silly size limits, maybe the same with salmon? and the children can fish perch of the dock for a child rate. Oh... $250 too much to fish salmon and halibut? Sure! stay home then! Awesome!!! Fixing all the broken stuff, the people that don't care about the resource can stay home and buy a couple cases of beer with their horded pocket change, drink it and then whiz it away on the ground... as they would be standing on land, not the back of a fishing boat!
I'm not rich, by no means, hope to be able to afford my first boat soon but not for certain. But I am willing to do what it takes. Anybody else or am I just a nut and stand alone, and better to horde your money and take whatever scraps the govt throws our way as they restrict more and more?
I think it is important to set expectations as to what sports anglers can accomplish.
As an example, consider AABM (Aggregate Abundance Based Management) and ISBM (Individual Stock Based Management) - I will leave it up to you to google definitions. These 2 different methods of managing Salmon catches and where each method is employed are well-imbedded into the Pacific Salon Treaty. This & other Treaty issues would be difficult for us to directly influence.
Before any more money is collected & spent, I'd like to see much greater accountability from the various governing bodies (US/BC) involved in Salmon.
As an example, look at the total lack of public information about the "Alaska Chinook Closure"; we have little idea who really did this & why they did this? What runs need protecting? If I look at the tables that begin on page 90 of the Pacific Salmon Treaty:
http://www.psc.org/publications/pacific-salmon-treaty/
Many of the runs protected by the Alaska closure are also caught in BC.
Raising the License fee and making anyone from outside BC a non-resident is a great idea.
It's a complex problem requiring a complex solution.
One of Trapper's suggestions (egg fertilization) was employed in Rivers inlet with great success. Many of the Northern BC lodges are contributing to similar work.
Many other things will work.
All this rant/rave stuff will not work.
As an example, consider AABM (Aggregate Abundance Based Management) and ISBM (Individual Stock Based Management) - I will leave it up to you to google definitions. These 2 different methods of managing Salmon catches and where each method is employed are well-imbedded into the Pacific Salon Treaty. This & other Treaty issues would be difficult for us to directly influence.
Before any more money is collected & spent, I'd like to see much greater accountability from the various governing bodies (US/BC) involved in Salmon.
As an example, look at the total lack of public information about the "Alaska Chinook Closure"; we have little idea who really did this & why they did this? What runs need protecting? If I look at the tables that begin on page 90 of the Pacific Salmon Treaty:
http://www.psc.org/publications/pacific-salmon-treaty/
Many of the runs protected by the Alaska closure are also caught in BC.
Raising the License fee and making anyone from outside BC a non-resident is a great idea.
It's a complex problem requiring a complex solution.
One of Trapper's suggestions (egg fertilization) was employed in Rivers inlet with great success. Many of the Northern BC lodges are contributing to similar work.
Many other things will work.
All this rant/rave stuff will not work.
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
The fish belong to the people of Canada, not the people of British Columbia.
People in all of Canada pay for DFO.
Do your homework, please.
Also, the SFAB has asked for an increase in licensing for years.
The governments have not done anything about this yet. Both party's have been in power but neither has done anything.
By the way, who is going to control and decide what to do with all this money you want raised?
People in all of Canada pay for DFO.
Do your homework, please.
Also, the SFAB has asked for an increase in licensing for years.
The governments have not done anything about this yet. Both party's have been in power but neither has done anything.
By the way, who is going to control and decide what to do with all this money you want raised?
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