Kicker Advice

[Max123]

looks nice but the mounting plate is not long enough to support the entire engine and the thrust of the engine pushes on the bottom

This bracket is intended for manual tilt, max 6hp outboard. In that size range, the transom brackets are typically only 6" high which this bracket can fully support. Even many 9.9 kickers with manual tilt only use a 6" bracket (although some are up to 8").

Its only when you get into power tilt that the brackets get much taller. For example,a yamaha 8hp with power tilt is going to need a minimum 13" bracket.

The size is a noted/intentional limitation of the design but my boat is just way too light to have a +100lbs kicker offset to one side and 6hp with a high thrust prop is going to give me all the power i can use.

 

[Rayvon]

I would agree with "Noluck" and you might get tired of the manual tilt and tiller if you fish a lot and eventually want power tilt and remote which needs about 12-13" vertically.

 

[zurk]

dump the kicker and just add a small DC generator and DC trolling motor to the outboard.

Engine Mount Trolling Motors | Minn Kota | Motorguide

Mounts to your outboard engine, saving valuable deck space A great choice for dual-purpose boats, or where a traditional installation is difficult Motor speed controlled via wired remote. Steered via the existing outboard wheel Variable speed motors ranging from 55 to 160 lbs Will it fit your...

www.trollingmotors.net

 

[Max123]

dump the kicker and just add a small DC generator and DC trolling motor to the outboard.

Engine Mount Trolling Motors | Minn Kota | Motorguide

Mounts to your outboard engine, saving valuable deck space A great choice for dual-purpose boats, or where a traditional installation is difficult Motor speed controlled via wired remote. Steered via the existing outboard wheel Variable speed motors ranging from 55 to 160 lbs Will it fit your...

www.trollingmotors.net

Its intended as my 'rescue' kicker for trips up to Pitt Lake. Consider it a redundant backup / safety gear rather than everyday use item. From Grant Narrows to our favorite beach, its about 15-18km, plus my marina is an additional 15km further down river - so I think the Minn Kota option is out.

Scenario is: its 4pm on a sunday afternoon, and we are about to head home from one of our favorite beaches with a few friends + kids and... click, click - motor won't start. As I mentioned earlier, I've 'almost' been in this scenario once or twice due to an intermittent starter solenoid which randomly failed, and then just as randomly started working again after a minute or two of tinkering/swearing. Its a terrible feeling when you are responsible for 5-6 people (including kids) and you are stuck trying to wave down a tow back to the dock (There is no Sea-Tow service that I'm aware of up in Pitt Lake). I've towed people back a few times, and you can always see the look of panic/helplessness in their eyes.

Not for me.

The 6hp doesn't need to be pretty, quiet, or have all the pleasantries (power trim, power start) - but a Tohatsu Sailpro with a decent gear ratio + a high thrust prop and we should be able to make it back at an unhurried 6-7mph before the sun sets. Everyone on board will be comforted by the sweet sound of that annoying single-cylinder engine rattling through the hull because we are making progress in the right direction. A few might even laugh and crack open a drink and enjoy the slow cruise back in the late afternoon sun...

The tohatsu can be configured with a tie bar to the main, and can also be optioned with remote throttle control if I want to use it as a trolling rig - but that wasn't really the idea. It may even be small enough that I can stow it inside the boat under one of the seats, so it only makes an appearance in an emergency. An 8hp yamaha high thrust would be ideal - but at an additional $1200 and +45lbs, that didn't seem like the right call.

 

[Aquaholic]

I have a manual tilt with tiller (9.9) but use the easy-tie-bar set up to steer with the main from the console. Super easy to configure as both engine are on the same transom lip. I use it every time I go out, it is not a problem at all. Simplicity.

 

[Max123]

I have a manual tilt with tiller (9.9) but use the easy-tie-bar set up to steer with the main from the console. Super easy to configure as both engine are on the same transom lip. I use it every time I go out, it is not a problem at all. Simplicity.

Did you make your own tie-bar? I was looking at a few options, and thought that I could likely fab one up with threaded rod and two ball joints. I see there are a few off the shelf ones as well.

 

[Aquaholic]

Did you make your own tie-bar? I was looking at a few options, and thought that I could likely fab one up with threaded rod and two ball joints. I see there are a few off the shelf ones as well.

Pic attached, excuse the chinook from last year and repeat pic. The only change I made was to invert the nipple to better align the rod angle to parallel, and this pic shows that. It was upward on the kicker when I got the boat. It works so well with Sea Star, such a sweet system.
Modern kickers start on one or two pulls, my kicker came with the boat and was only a year old with a few hours, no reason to change it. Save weight, money, wiring etc. I still suggest you try without a remote tank, tap into the fuel filter and see if it works. Add the remote tank if not satisfied.

 

[zurk]

Its intended as my 'rescue' kicker for trips up to Pitt Lake. Consider it a redundant backup / safety gear rather than everyday use item. From Grant Narrows to our favorite beach, its about 15-18km, plus my marina is an additional 15km further down river - so I think the Minn Kota option is out.

Scenario is: its 4pm on a sunday afternoon, and we are about to head home from one of our favorite beaches with a few friends + kids and... click, click - motor won't start. As I mentioned earlier, I've 'almost' been in this scenario once or twice due to an intermittent starter solenoid which randomly failed, and then just as randomly started working again after a minute or two of tinkering/swearing. Its a terrible feeling when you are responsible for 5-6 people (including kids) and you are stuck trying to wave down a tow back to the dock (There is no Sea-Tow service that I'm aware of up in Pitt Lake). I've towed people back a few times, and you can always see the look of panic/helplessness in their eyes.

Not for me.

The 6hp doesn't need to be pretty, quiet, or have all the pleasantries (power trim, power start) - but a Tohatsu Sailpro with a decent gear ratio + a high thrust prop and we should be able to make it back at an unhurried 6-7mph before the sun sets. Everyone on board will be comforted by the sweet sound of that annoying single-cylinder engine rattling through the hull because we are making progress in the right direction. A few might even laugh and crack open a drink and enjoy the slow cruise back in the late afternoon sun...

The tohatsu can be configured with a tie bar to the main, and can also be optioned with remote throttle control if I want to use it as a trolling rig - but that wasn't really the idea. It may even be small enough that I can stow it inside the boat under one of the seats, so it only makes an appearance in an emergency. An 8hp yamaha high thrust would be ideal - but at an additional $1200 and +45lbs, that didn't seem like the right call.

i have a tohatsu sailpro 6HP. what everyone doesnt tell you is that its a royal pain to start with the pull cord. it will only start if the weather is above a decent temp and hot. it wont start all the time until you arm practically falls out of its socket. honestly if i had to do it again i would ditch the sail pro and use a DC genny + minn kota. the DC genny will use your boat fuel and power it until you run out of fuel and the minn kota will work immediately everytime with no struggling with pull cords. get an electric start kicker or electric motor+genny. the small kickers are useless. youre right that IF you can get them to work they will get you home no problems. its getting them to work thats the problem. the tiny little fuel feed pinprick (carb jet) gets gummed up real fast and over time it becomes harder and harder to start until its practically impossible. the parts are microscopic and delicate. if you DO want a sailpro with 15 hours of run time for cheap let me know. has a full remote throttle and shift setup too with tie bar.

 

[Aquaholic]

i have a tohatsu sailpro 6HP. what everyone doesnt tell you is that its a royal pain to start with the pull cord. it will only start if the weather is above a decent temp and hot. it wont start all the time until you arm practically falls out of its socket. honestly if i had to do it again i would ditch the sail pro and use a DC genny + minn kota. the DC genny will use your boat fuel and power it until you run out of fuel and the minn kota will work immediately everytime with no struggling with pull cords. get an electric start kicker or electric motor+genny. the small kickers are useless. youre right that IF you can get them to work they will get you home no problems. its getting them to work thats the problem. the tiny little fuel feed pinprick (carb jet) gets gummed up real fast and over time it becomes harder and harder to start until its practically impossible. the parts are microscopic and delicate. if you DO want a sailpro with 15 hours of run time for cheap let me know. has a full remote throttle and shift setup too with tie bar.

Primer bulb. One or two pulls. Go.

 

[SpringVelocity]

Here's the proposed kicker bracket setup. Bit weird due to the rounded swim grid. Will be 1/4" aluminum plate. The tie down eye will get moved further out. I wanted something that looked like it was part of the original build.

Looking for some advice on selecting a kicker for my boat.

I have an 18ft aluminum centre console (20ft overall with pod/hull extension). I use it mainly for pleasure up in Pitt Lake, and we typically take a few friends with kids as well. Last year I had two cases where the motor wouldn't start at the end of the day - completely dead, and then mysteriously started after about a minute of fussing around. The issue appears to be resolved with a new starter solenoid, and hasn't come back. In spite of carrying around all the typical tools, jump pack, radio, etc - it made me realize I'm not comfortable with having a single point of failure and needed a backup for my own peace of mind.

Anyway, I'm having the transom modified to add a bracket, and I plan on buying a kicker as a failsafe. It would just be a pull start, tiller steering and run on its own separate fuel tank to keep everything completely separate from the main. Bare bones setup - if this thing never gets used, I'll be happy. Doesn't need to be the quietest, smoothest, prettiest or most powerful - it just needs to get us back. Ideally light and easily removable, so I can store it and not worry about theft.

A +100lbs 9.9hp kicker is not really an option based on my transom and the weight balance of the boat. However, I think a 6hp should get me up to hull speed and most seem to to be in the 55-60lbs range.

If you search online the consensus is that all 6hp kickers are basically the same, but that doesn't seem to be the case at all once you get into the spec. For my application, I think I need a high thrust gear ratio, low pitch / large diameter prop, whereas most of these motors are setup for powering around little tenders.

Here's what I found:
Suzuki DF6: 55lbs / 138cc / gearing = 1.92:1 / 3-blade 7.5" diameter x 6" pitch
Yamaha F6: 60lbs / 139cc / gearing = 2.08:1 / seems like standard prop is similar to suzuki, but the internet leads me to believe it 'may' swing a bigger 9" diameter prop
Tohatsu MFS6 'Sailpro': 57lbs / gearing = 2.15:1 / 8.3" diameter x 6" pitch (high thrust prop)

Prior to doing any research, I was thinking of a Suzuki - but this seems like its more setup for a small tender (geared for speed) and as far as I can tell there are no aftermarket/high thrust prop options. The yamaha seems like it 'could' be ok with the better gearing, but only if I can get a larger prop and that seems unclear. The sailpro seem to tick all the boxes, but I've never owned one.

Anyway, always appreciate the knowledgable feedback.

Get the suzuki. You don't need a high thrust. It is light boat on lake. Also the suzuki is fuel injection less headaches. Get a new one with zero hours and full warranty.

 

[zurk]

Primer bulb. One or two pulls. Go.

lol. like i havent tried that and every combination imaginable. even taking it to the dealership. like i said, its fine in hot weather but crap in cold weather or at random times when you really really need it. not even used with ethanol fuel so there should be anything gumming up the carbs. the motor is a 2020 and only 15 hours so practically new. oil change has been done, sparkplugs replaced. everything i could think of. manual start kickers are just garbage.

 

[Max123]

@zurk - Interesting, none of the online reviews for the sailpro indicate that its hard to start, but not really a surprise. When I was a kid we used to have an early 1980s Mercury 115 - 2-stroke, straight 6 'tower of power'. My dad was a builder and knew everything there was to know about residential construction and concrete, but hadn't the slightest interest in boats or preventative maintenance. Every spring I'd put the boat in the water, battery stone dead, and I'd pull start that old 2-stroke back to life with the emergency rope on the flywheel. That was a tough start.

Too bad they don't put a decompression valve on these small single cylinder motors.

 

[Max123]

Get the suzuki. You don't need a high thrust. It is light boat on lake. Also the suzuki is fuel injection less headaches. Get a new one with zero hours and full warranty.

Unfortunately the little single cylinder suzukis aren't injected or I'd buy one for sure. I initially was going to just buy a Zuk because I've had good experience with them, but when you run the numbers you start to realize its not the right tool for the job.

The Suzuki has 1.92:1 gearing and a 6" pitch prop (lowest pitch available - seemingly no aftermarket high-thrust options), you get a theoretical top speed (ie. 0% slip) of 14.8mph @ 5000rpm . Hull speed on my boat is going to be around 6-7mph - so what does that mean? What I suspect it means is that that little Suzuki is either going to cavitate like mad at full throttle @ 127% slip like a tiny little blender, or more likely, its going to bog down/lug the engine and not get anywhere close to 5000rpm, so its not making full power/thrust.

If you run the numbers on the Sailpro, with 2.15:1 gearing and a 5" pitch high thrust prop, you get a theoretical top speed of 11mph - this still gives pretty high slip at around 65%, but if you drop to 4000rpms the theoretical speed is 8.8mph & 35% slip - totally reasonable. Likewise, i can get a large diameter, 4 blade 'big ear' high thrust prop to maximize low speed thrust so I likely don't need to rev it out so much either. The sailpro has a pretty decent reputation for pushing around 25-30ft sailboats, even into headwind.

The numbers tell you the story: the Suzuki is built for light little inflatable tenders to zoom around the harbour. The Sailpro (when paired with the right prop) is built to push around small sailboats. Its like riding a bike up a hill - the brand of your bike doesn't really matter, being in the right gear is what gets you to the top.

 

[Max123]

lol. like i havent tried that and every combination imaginable. even taking it to the dealership. like i said, its fine in hot weather but crap in cold weather or at random times when you really really need it. not even used with ethanol fuel so there should be anything gumming up the carbs. the motor is a 2020 and only 15 hours so practically new. oil change has been done, sparkplugs replaced. everything i could think of. manual start kickers are just garbage.

possibly looking to sell a low hours Sailpro...? I might know a guy... (play it cool Max, pretend you don't really need it...)

 

[zurk]

possibly looking to sell a low hours Sailpro...? I might know a guy... (play it cool Max, pretend you don't really need it...)

haha. DM me. we can make it happen on any weekend. since i also have an 18 footer the controls should also fit right at your helm. we can meet at pitt lake if you want.

EDIT: Kicker is SOLD!. Thanks to the member who took that PoS out of my hands.

 

[salmonkiller01]

I was led to believe the smaller mercury outboards and Suzuki are tohatsu power heads. @shiphappens would know for sure

 

[ryanonthevedder]

What ever brand you choose make sure there is someone close for service and *parts*

Merc is #1 in BC for parts followed by Yamaha. Its not so bad if you plan ahead but if you're out on a trip and need something you'll be glad its not a Honda...

 

[Pineapple Express]

I was led to believe the smaller mercury outboards and Suzuki are tohatsu power heads. @shiphappens would know for sure

For the last several years all Mercury motors under 60hp are Tohatsus.

 

[trophywife]

yam 6hp , adjust the throw on the linkage and put a 8hp high thrust prop on it.
my set up on the ol trophy.

 

[Eden Island]

dump the kicker and just add a small DC generator and DC trolling motor to the outboard.

Engine Mount Trolling Motors | Minn Kota | Motorguide

Mounts to your outboard engine, saving valuable deck space A great choice for dual-purpose boats, or where a traditional installation is difficult Motor speed controlled via wired remote. Steered via the existing outboard wheel Variable speed motors ranging from 55 to 160 lbs Will it fit your...

www.trollingmotors.net

A member installed one of these motors a few years ago [Andrew P] with batteries and solar backup -- but when I was investigating this option I found that the entire line of engine mounted trolling motors was discontinued by Minn Kota - leaving only transom or bow mounted electric motors. It still appears to be the case on the Minn Kota site - https://minnkota.johnsonoutdoors.com/us/shop/trolling-motors