wild steelhead coalition
- Thread starter Derby
- Start date
Yes, but this particular discussion is Thompson and Chilcotin steelhead. I wasn't sure how a US based coalition could help but obviously I missed the importance of bringing the issue to a broader audience.
Sharphooks
Well-Known Member
I would argue that the geographical location of where a Wild Steelhead Coalition member sat while writing that Wild Steelhead Manifesto is completely besides the point. The issues that wild steelhead face are the same for BC origin fish as they are for USA origin fish. The 49th Parallel is irrelevant.
That Manifesto is a wake up call to all who call themselves steelheaders or to anybody who has made their livings off the backs of this dwindling resource. I refer to fishing gear hucksters like Oscars Fly and Tackle in Smithers or FlywaterTravel in Ashland, Oregon, whose skill set appears to be spoon-feeding an endless stream of white-shoed clients into the hungry mouths of lodges on the Kispiox and Babine.
From the outside looking in, neither of those businesses appear to have given anything back to the steelhead resource. And with FlywaterTravel in mind, it was revolting to read what they were writing on their website in late August this year when it was unclear if FLNRORD would keep the Skeena open beyond 01 September. It was all a sly wink...wink...the unstated implications being:
.....trust us....we have the inside scoop......no reason to cancel your trips, Gents...step right up. Lots more where that came from. We have the FLNRORD guys on speed dial around here, and the Tyee Test Results were probably Fake News anyway so all is well....
Then they had the unmitigated gall to promote the “One and Done” concept, like somehow catching your one fish for the day and getting off the river (wink,wink) would absolve FLNRORD from unleashing a plague of guided jet boats on a run of fish that was clearly projected to be dramatically below historical threshhold levels
For decades it’s been take...take...take...wild steelhead are the gift that keeps on giving, especially Skeena steelhead....a bottomless pit of chrome lucre
The WSC document is simply pointing out that those days are OVER. Chest-thumping and high-fiving after big number days are OVER. Promoting river destinations on the Skeena and hyperbolizing about all those big-number days you can have at an $ 8,000 a week Lodge are OVER. It’s time to focus on habitat degredation and what can be done about it. It’s time to discuss what we all can do as a group to support and protect the resource and the rivers these fish swim in instead of making bank selling all that sophisticated fishing gear and lodge room and board to the people who chase those fish.
And what they didn’t mention in that Manifesto: significantly reduced levels of dissolved oxygen levels in areas of the salt chuck to the point where you’ll see the term hypoxia discussed more and more in scientific journals. Is hypoxia limited to Hood Canal in Washington State? No, hyper-eutrophication and rising temperatures that limit the amount of dissolved oxygen in surface waters does not respect borders. Look at Saanich Inlet with its own set of problems with hypoxia. And then there are micro-plastics in the marine environment. None of these environmental variables respect borders.
WSC was arguing those very points——-the problem wild steelhead face is everybody’d problem. They are the canaries in the coal mine. It’s a wake-up call to all of us who care about the status of wild steelhead and I applaud them for ringing that bell loud and clear in a very well written plea.
Meanwhile....
I have a business relationship with several companies in Vancouver. One of them is a well-known seafood business. Yesterday he mentioned that chum roe was fetching $ 40/kg in Vancouver and what a great thing that was for the fishermen. I blew coffee through my nose. Dude, do you know what the ecological cost is of that chum roe? Are you aware of the peripheral genocide that is going down every time a gill net is set in the Fraser to get that chum roe? No, he didn’t. He had heard of the Thompson River but didn’t know that the Albion counts were coming in at zero for most of October and he didn’t really know what the implications were of that in-river chum fishery, a fishery sanctioned by the freaking DFO, a fishery which completely and utterly blows my mind. Is there one shred of scientific justification in a document sitting on a DFO guy’s desk supporting the decision to allow these openings right in the middle of prime-time Thompson and Chilcotin River steelhead migrations (All five of them?)
It struck me: he’s probably like many other people in Vancouver.....they’re well-intentioned but don’t have a clue that an entire race of IFS steelhead is swirling around the drain and in 2021, just might go down that drain.
Yes, agentaqua, I fully agree: any kind of problem solving must include the First Nation groups that rely on the resources. Yes, I recognize they have court rulings to lean on that protect those rights. No way around that. But as a first step, I think each and every Fraser River in-river gill netter should be paid off, given a fistfull of dollars to get their asses off the river. Pay them off. Buy them out. Give them the value of that chum roe.
Tell me there’s such a fund that is oficially sanctioned and officially administrated and I will slash and burn both my daughter’s projected inheritances to pay into that Fund
Really.
Can you set one up?
That Manifesto is a wake up call to all who call themselves steelheaders or to anybody who has made their livings off the backs of this dwindling resource. I refer to fishing gear hucksters like Oscars Fly and Tackle in Smithers or FlywaterTravel in Ashland, Oregon, whose skill set appears to be spoon-feeding an endless stream of white-shoed clients into the hungry mouths of lodges on the Kispiox and Babine.
From the outside looking in, neither of those businesses appear to have given anything back to the steelhead resource. And with FlywaterTravel in mind, it was revolting to read what they were writing on their website in late August this year when it was unclear if FLNRORD would keep the Skeena open beyond 01 September. It was all a sly wink...wink...the unstated implications being:
.....trust us....we have the inside scoop......no reason to cancel your trips, Gents...step right up. Lots more where that came from. We have the FLNRORD guys on speed dial around here, and the Tyee Test Results were probably Fake News anyway so all is well....
Then they had the unmitigated gall to promote the “One and Done” concept, like somehow catching your one fish for the day and getting off the river (wink,wink) would absolve FLNRORD from unleashing a plague of guided jet boats on a run of fish that was clearly projected to be dramatically below historical threshhold levels
For decades it’s been take...take...take...wild steelhead are the gift that keeps on giving, especially Skeena steelhead....a bottomless pit of chrome lucre
The WSC document is simply pointing out that those days are OVER. Chest-thumping and high-fiving after big number days are OVER. Promoting river destinations on the Skeena and hyperbolizing about all those big-number days you can have at an $ 8,000 a week Lodge are OVER. It’s time to focus on habitat degredation and what can be done about it. It’s time to discuss what we all can do as a group to support and protect the resource and the rivers these fish swim in instead of making bank selling all that sophisticated fishing gear and lodge room and board to the people who chase those fish.
And what they didn’t mention in that Manifesto: significantly reduced levels of dissolved oxygen levels in areas of the salt chuck to the point where you’ll see the term hypoxia discussed more and more in scientific journals. Is hypoxia limited to Hood Canal in Washington State? No, hyper-eutrophication and rising temperatures that limit the amount of dissolved oxygen in surface waters does not respect borders. Look at Saanich Inlet with its own set of problems with hypoxia. And then there are micro-plastics in the marine environment. None of these environmental variables respect borders.
WSC was arguing those very points——-the problem wild steelhead face is everybody’d problem. They are the canaries in the coal mine. It’s a wake-up call to all of us who care about the status of wild steelhead and I applaud them for ringing that bell loud and clear in a very well written plea.
Meanwhile....
I have a business relationship with several companies in Vancouver. One of them is a well-known seafood business. Yesterday he mentioned that chum roe was fetching $ 40/kg in Vancouver and what a great thing that was for the fishermen. I blew coffee through my nose. Dude, do you know what the ecological cost is of that chum roe? Are you aware of the peripheral genocide that is going down every time a gill net is set in the Fraser to get that chum roe? No, he didn’t. He had heard of the Thompson River but didn’t know that the Albion counts were coming in at zero for most of October and he didn’t really know what the implications were of that in-river chum fishery, a fishery sanctioned by the freaking DFO, a fishery which completely and utterly blows my mind. Is there one shred of scientific justification in a document sitting on a DFO guy’s desk supporting the decision to allow these openings right in the middle of prime-time Thompson and Chilcotin River steelhead migrations (All five of them?)
It struck me: he’s probably like many other people in Vancouver.....they’re well-intentioned but don’t have a clue that an entire race of IFS steelhead is swirling around the drain and in 2021, just might go down that drain.
Yes, agentaqua, I fully agree: any kind of problem solving must include the First Nation groups that rely on the resources. Yes, I recognize they have court rulings to lean on that protect those rights. No way around that. But as a first step, I think each and every Fraser River in-river gill netter should be paid off, given a fistfull of dollars to get their asses off the river. Pay them off. Buy them out. Give them the value of that chum roe.
Tell me there’s such a fund that is oficially sanctioned and officially administrated and I will slash and burn both my daughter’s projected inheritances to pay into that Fund
Really.
Can you set one up?
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Thanks again for a respectful, informative and rewarding dialogue, Sharphooks. I'm learning lots.
Let me reciprocate: the legal, regulatory regime for any fisheries including enforcement and monitoring are key to successful fisheries management. In that context and seen thru that lens - whether the regulator is American, Canadian or Provincial/State very much matters. I would argue that a Canadian steelhead lobby/ENGO would have limited if any success lobbying for steelhead management in the States and vice-versa - so geographic location very much matters. It would be naïve to suggest that it doesn't matter. Try telling a border official that 49th Parallel is irrelevant as you try to pass thru. Good luck with that.
Not that international processes never work - but you have to have buy-in from the top on both sides with a functioning process to accept, integrate and implement any changes to fisheries management. That was the intent at least with the Pacific Salmon Treaty. Some lessons to learn there, as well.
Not that lobbying has no effect, neither - but really the success is quite noticeable if there is any - and there also has to be willingness from our governments to change which over some 20+yrs in the fisheries management field I only have seen coming the last few years in Canada after First Nations have taken the feds to court over s.35 of the Constitution Act.
The offer to buy out commercial gillnetters on the Fraser may have some impact if that comes to pass. Right now there are big changes coming to the commercial fleet (again) including gillnetters thru the implementation of the new Fisheries Act and the Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative. Are you familiar with this? and the new parts of the Fisheries Act that are being implemented? many commercial fishermen will be looking for buy-outs.
Let me reciprocate: the legal, regulatory regime for any fisheries including enforcement and monitoring are key to successful fisheries management. In that context and seen thru that lens - whether the regulator is American, Canadian or Provincial/State very much matters. I would argue that a Canadian steelhead lobby/ENGO would have limited if any success lobbying for steelhead management in the States and vice-versa - so geographic location very much matters. It would be naïve to suggest that it doesn't matter. Try telling a border official that 49th Parallel is irrelevant as you try to pass thru. Good luck with that.
Not that international processes never work - but you have to have buy-in from the top on both sides with a functioning process to accept, integrate and implement any changes to fisheries management. That was the intent at least with the Pacific Salmon Treaty. Some lessons to learn there, as well.
Not that lobbying has no effect, neither - but really the success is quite noticeable if there is any - and there also has to be willingness from our governments to change which over some 20+yrs in the fisheries management field I only have seen coming the last few years in Canada after First Nations have taken the feds to court over s.35 of the Constitution Act.
The offer to buy out commercial gillnetters on the Fraser may have some impact if that comes to pass. Right now there are big changes coming to the commercial fleet (again) including gillnetters thru the implementation of the new Fisheries Act and the Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative. Are you familiar with this? and the new parts of the Fisheries Act that are being implemented? many commercial fishermen will be looking for buy-outs.
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Sharphooks
Well-Known Member
It is straightforward to read the mission statements of the new Fisheries Act and the Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative, though it seems like perhaps too wide a net is being thrown when considering the full scope of what Fisheries and Oceans is trying to accomplish.
But color me skeptical about the promise of successful outcomes for the health of ALL the related fisheries in PNW Canada if the main beneficiaries of available salmon quotas and commercial licenses gravitate towards FN ownership (which seems to be the Initiative’s unspoken intent)
If we take the demise of IFS as a case study and a litmus test of how FN groups might conduct themselves when inheriting this type of resource privelge, I feel a deep sense of dismay. Stewardship is the responsible use of a resource, but in a way that takes into full account not only the interests of society and future generations (food and cereminial purposes etc) but the health and welfare of other species as well. I do not see any of that happening with the current commercial chum fishery being conducted on the Fraser. One can be absolutely certain that both DFO and FN fishers are completely aware that their actions are wiping IFS off the face of mother earth, yet still they persist. They are doing this TODAY. More chum openings!!!
Excuse my cynicism but just the idea of the DFO and FN fishers prosecuting these Fraser chum fisheries is a spit in the eye of all the high falutin’ do-gooder talk one can read at length in both the New Fisheries Act and the Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative. It is downright laughable when viewed through the lens of the IFS demise. This isn’t an insult that happened 20 years ago....it’s happening TODAY and all the high-talk in the PSSI was supposed to take effect in 2021....TODAY
Meanwhile, I noticed that there is language in the Fisheries Act that esentially says.....do all fish no harm
All fish.
If only the initiative had been called The Pacific Salmonid Initiative?
But color me skeptical about the promise of successful outcomes for the health of ALL the related fisheries in PNW Canada if the main beneficiaries of available salmon quotas and commercial licenses gravitate towards FN ownership (which seems to be the Initiative’s unspoken intent)
If we take the demise of IFS as a case study and a litmus test of how FN groups might conduct themselves when inheriting this type of resource privelge, I feel a deep sense of dismay. Stewardship is the responsible use of a resource, but in a way that takes into full account not only the interests of society and future generations (food and cereminial purposes etc) but the health and welfare of other species as well. I do not see any of that happening with the current commercial chum fishery being conducted on the Fraser. One can be absolutely certain that both DFO and FN fishers are completely aware that their actions are wiping IFS off the face of mother earth, yet still they persist. They are doing this TODAY. More chum openings!!!
Excuse my cynicism but just the idea of the DFO and FN fishers prosecuting these Fraser chum fisheries is a spit in the eye of all the high falutin’ do-gooder talk one can read at length in both the New Fisheries Act and the Pacific Salmon Strategy Initiative. It is downright laughable when viewed through the lens of the IFS demise. This isn’t an insult that happened 20 years ago....it’s happening TODAY and all the high-talk in the PSSI was supposed to take effect in 2021....TODAY
Meanwhile, I noticed that there is language in the Fisheries Act that esentially says.....do all fish no harm
All fish.
If only the initiative had been called The Pacific Salmonid Initiative?
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wildmanyeah
Crew Member
The only boats on the river this year fishing for chum are First Nations they are not permitted to sell there catch.
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searun
Well-Known Member
From the sounds of comments re: Fraser in-river fisheries for Chum that may impact IFS, I'm not seeing any approved Gill Net fisheries in the Fisheries Notices - only fishery would be the test fishery at Albion. The pink fisheries were all beach seine, with non-retention of non-target species. If there are no Commercial fisheries, and no FN Economic Opportunity Fisheries, and window closures in place to protect IFS - what am I missing here?
Clip from Fisheries Notice for FN Economic Opportunity fisheries also says no fishing:
In-season estimates of return-to-the-mouth ("terminal") abundance for Fraser River Chum Salmon are based on current year's catch information provided by the Albion test fishery, combined with historical information on the probable range of run size, timing, expansion line, and duration of the run. The Chum-directed test fishing gill net (6.75" mesh) is fished every other day from September 1 to October 20, then daily through November 10, then every other day until November 23. More details of the Albion test fishery can be found on the DFO website: http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/fraser/index-eng.html
Catch in the Chum net through October 22 totals 1,974 Chum Salmon. Combining this data with the historical information in a Bayesian non-linear regression model results in an estimated terminal Fraser River Chum Salmon return of 481,000 Chum (median estimate), with a 50% migration date of October 17. The return is expected to be between 400,000 and 577,000 (80% probability), and it is almost certain that the return will not meet the escapement goal of 800,000. This return is approximately half of the brood year return and the second lowest return in a decade.
The current run size estimate is insufficient to allow for recreational and commercial opportunities (including First Nations Economic Opportunities) in the Fraser River.
Clip from Fisheries Notice for FN Economic Opportunity fisheries also says no fishing:
In-season estimates of return-to-the-mouth ("terminal") abundance for Fraser River Chum Salmon are based on current year's catch information provided by the Albion test fishery, combined with historical information on the probable range of run size, timing, expansion line, and duration of the run. The Chum-directed test fishing gill net (6.75" mesh) is fished every other day from September 1 to October 20, then daily through November 10, then every other day until November 23. More details of the Albion test fishery can be found on the DFO website: http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/fraser/index-eng.html
Catch in the Chum net through October 22 totals 1,974 Chum Salmon. Combining this data with the historical information in a Bayesian non-linear regression model results in an estimated terminal Fraser River Chum Salmon return of 481,000 Chum (median estimate), with a 50% migration date of October 17. The return is expected to be between 400,000 and 577,000 (80% probability), and it is almost certain that the return will not meet the escapement goal of 800,000. This return is approximately half of the brood year return and the second lowest return in a decade.
The current run size estimate is insufficient to allow for recreational and commercial opportunities (including First Nations Economic Opportunities) in the Fraser River.
Not permitted to sell there catch....lofl.
These openings should mop up the last of any steelhead and completely decimate any chance of getting chum to our local flows.. Selective beach seining.....sounds great on paper or to people not around these fisheries.
These openings this last week and and over the next few weeks goes to show how you what chance our salmon stocks in the Fraser have with DFO.
Everyday for the past couple weeks there has been netting in the lower Fraser.
With the complete collapse this year of our Fraser Chum.....you have to ask yourself why are we even doing test fisheries at this point? In stream numbers can be counted easily. We already have a DFO helicopter flying daily to count sport anglers.
These openings should mop up the last of any steelhead and completely decimate any chance of getting chum to our local flows.. Selective beach seining.....sounds great on paper or to people not around these fisheries.
These openings this last week and and over the next few weeks goes to show how you what chance our salmon stocks in the Fraser have with DFO.
Everyday for the past couple weeks there has been netting in the lower Fraser.
With the complete collapse this year of our Fraser Chum.....you have to ask yourself why are we even doing test fisheries at this point? In stream numbers can be counted easily. We already have a DFO helicopter flying daily to count sport anglers.
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Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Ya right WMY !!!
wildmanyeah
Crew Member
are you permitted to go over the speed limit? I didn't say they dont sell their catch they all do. I would think that most of SFBC knows that FSC catch to the lower fraser is just a weekend cash crab,
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Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Exagerly !
There’s virtually no chum returning to the northern Fraser tribs. It’s pretty sad watching the empty creeks and rivers that used to be full of fish by late October. It’s not much better on the southern side of the Fraser either. Those runs are bit earlier but this year has been a super low run of chums. Can’t think of anything but the in-river gil nets as the culprit and the devastation that it’s brought to the entire ecosystem.
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
Some facts you all need to be aware of.
There are 28 Chinook stocks in the Southern area.
Of this, 12 Are endangered. 7 are threatened. 5 are data deficient. 2 are special concern.
There are 2 stocks that are not at risk.
Welcome to Steelhead.
There are 28 Chinook stocks in the Southern area.
Of this, 12 Are endangered. 7 are threatened. 5 are data deficient. 2 are special concern.
There are 2 stocks that are not at risk.
Welcome to Steelhead.
searun
Well-Known Member
Awesome thanks for posting the links, I couldn't find them. Certainly no commercial gill net fisheries and no Economic Opportunity Fisheries should help. I wonder how these fisheries align to the Steelhead Window Closures - anyone know?
wildmanyeah
Crew Member
fsc only has a 27 day windows closure
tho they seemed to have gone pretty much from pinks to chum so who knows
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
Conservation does not trump money.
Money is the reason SARA was not used.
As of now there are only two stocks of Chinook on the south coast that are not endangered according to Science.
Think Science will save the other 26 stock, or will money rule?
There's the problem ... the runs are so small there isn't a peak time now. Historically Thompson fish were caught in the Chilliwack area of the Fraser from early September till November, mainly by bar fishing and a bycatch of salmon fishing. There was a small group of anglers who targeted steelhead all winter on the Fraser and did quite well.
I don't know of any data re Chilcotin steelhead migration.
The point is there should be zero nets in the Fraser now, not only to protect whatever is left of IFS, but to stop raping the chums.
Historically, peak migration thru Albion was Oct 10-15
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