So Let’s Talk About It, Halibut 2013
- Thread starter GLG
- Start date
searun
Well-Known Member
Trend Setters approach is a little optimistic as it doesn't take into account how TAC is determined and the huge variability in available TAC, catch rates, and shifting use patterns.
Here's my understanding of how it works - I'm sure others will weigh in and correct any errors.
The current available biomass determines the total TAC (set by IPHC), that is then divided up between the sectors using the 85/15 allocation model. This is based on achieving conservation goals and sustainable harvest - so any catch regulations are not in place for conservation - rather to simply ensure the correct allocation exploitation is achieved. With that in mind for the rec sector to stay within our available 15% TAC, we have regulatory options up to 2 per day, 3 possession which are set based on regulations affirmed through legislation. So we can fish 2 and 3 if we want in any fishing season, but with that choice comes consequences - a much, much shorter season. In other words, fears that anything less than 2 and 3 will be concessions that are permanent reductions in daily catch is simply an urban myth. Which option we choose really depends upon how long we wish the season to be. So in years of less abundance when the TAC is set low we have options to control catch rates using a variety of regulatory options - regardless of which option, all are measured using pounds caught. (current system is based on pounds caught using the average size per landed hali). So to make choices we need to look at the exploitation rates from prior seasons to estimate how long given exploitation rates of the various regulation choices it will take to use up our TAC.
IMO, the important thing to consider when selecting choices is to look closely at the fishing needs of the entire recreational angling group, including anglers who come from other parts of Canada on their vacations. For example, choices that front load our catch to use up the TAC quickly in March to May will have very adverse impacts on anglers from other parts of Canada who are normally only able to participate in the fishery during the usual summer vacation months (July/Aug).
My personal preference is to lean towards options which preserve opportunity to participate in the fishery for the widest possible cross section of anglers - longer season May to September. This in important because a big part of what attracts us all to fishing is the "opportunity" to catch a fish. If there is no opportunity (closed season), then interest levels in going fishing drop significantly. Trend Setter's options are logical, and would benefit by more narrowly defined regulation choices to make the widest use of the available TAC until other options he mentions would be able to take effect (shifting quota - would take years to implement). I also personally favor annual limits - 6 to 10 seems very reasonable, as does implementing a Halibut punch card system and conservation stamp.
Any way you slice it, this issue is very complex - there will be no simple and easy choices...all the more reason for us to get as much information to make informed decisions before we ask DFO to implement.
Here's my understanding of how it works - I'm sure others will weigh in and correct any errors.
The current available biomass determines the total TAC (set by IPHC), that is then divided up between the sectors using the 85/15 allocation model. This is based on achieving conservation goals and sustainable harvest - so any catch regulations are not in place for conservation - rather to simply ensure the correct allocation exploitation is achieved. With that in mind for the rec sector to stay within our available 15% TAC, we have regulatory options up to 2 per day, 3 possession which are set based on regulations affirmed through legislation. So we can fish 2 and 3 if we want in any fishing season, but with that choice comes consequences - a much, much shorter season. In other words, fears that anything less than 2 and 3 will be concessions that are permanent reductions in daily catch is simply an urban myth. Which option we choose really depends upon how long we wish the season to be. So in years of less abundance when the TAC is set low we have options to control catch rates using a variety of regulatory options - regardless of which option, all are measured using pounds caught. (current system is based on pounds caught using the average size per landed hali). So to make choices we need to look at the exploitation rates from prior seasons to estimate how long given exploitation rates of the various regulation choices it will take to use up our TAC.
IMO, the important thing to consider when selecting choices is to look closely at the fishing needs of the entire recreational angling group, including anglers who come from other parts of Canada on their vacations. For example, choices that front load our catch to use up the TAC quickly in March to May will have very adverse impacts on anglers from other parts of Canada who are normally only able to participate in the fishery during the usual summer vacation months (July/Aug).
My personal preference is to lean towards options which preserve opportunity to participate in the fishery for the widest possible cross section of anglers - longer season May to September. This in important because a big part of what attracts us all to fishing is the "opportunity" to catch a fish. If there is no opportunity (closed season), then interest levels in going fishing drop significantly. Trend Setter's options are logical, and would benefit by more narrowly defined regulation choices to make the widest use of the available TAC until other options he mentions would be able to take effect (shifting quota - would take years to implement). I also personally favor annual limits - 6 to 10 seems very reasonable, as does implementing a Halibut punch card system and conservation stamp.
Any way you slice it, this issue is very complex - there will be no simple and easy choices...all the more reason for us to get as much information to make informed decisions before we ask DFO to implement.
Islandgirl
Well-Known Member
We have gone over the Rec sector TAC this past year and in previous years.
DFO is holding our sector to task to stay within our allocation, I don't agree with the allocation myself and if you have done any reading this goes back a long ways to gifting of a common resource to a few select people. (Wrong)
I feel an annual limit of say 6-10 halibut should be enough for anyone. Helps prevent the lodges, etc from pre season fishing to fill the freezer and the gifting of fish as a start.
Is it enough, I am not sure.
I definately do not want to see us cut back to 1/1 possesion, and I would think this would really hurt the guide/lodges too.
1/2 is bad enough.
I don't think the slot size limit worked from what I have heard. Target the chicken holes and target them more often.
Possibly make it like prawn fishing in areas like Vic where you can only prawn half of the month.
Unless someone figures a way to go hold some politican at ransom we are tasked to find a solution to stay within the rec sector TAC
DFO is holding our sector to task to stay within our allocation, I don't agree with the allocation myself and if you have done any reading this goes back a long ways to gifting of a common resource to a few select people. (Wrong)
I feel an annual limit of say 6-10 halibut should be enough for anyone. Helps prevent the lodges, etc from pre season fishing to fill the freezer and the gifting of fish as a start.
Is it enough, I am not sure.
I definately do not want to see us cut back to 1/1 possesion, and I would think this would really hurt the guide/lodges too.
1/2 is bad enough.
I don't think the slot size limit worked from what I have heard. Target the chicken holes and target them more often.
Possibly make it like prawn fishing in areas like Vic where you can only prawn half of the month.
Unless someone figures a way to go hold some politican at ransom we are tasked to find a solution to stay within the rec sector TAC
lorneparker1
Banned
and more inportantly for the people that cant read through the lines. the Guides and outfitters that service these canadians. IM not agreeing or disagreeing just pointing out the obvious
I dont know the numbers off hand (i know they are available soon) but i cant imagine 6-10 each using DFO math is going to give us a longer season then we just had. maybe >5 which i would be good with. i would be good with a max of 4 hali a year TBH. 2 under 83cm and 2 over would be just fine. that would stil give the average local angler even if he caught all small suckers net 30-50lbs of hali, and would leave the oppotunity to catch a big one
However, i would like to go back to what Chad said. We should be very vocal at our dis pleasure of the DFO ramming this experimental BS down our throats. NO ONE wants this, yet they are moving foward. I am not sure if its doable but we should get that kicked out as a part of the deal.
Lorne
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OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
However, i would like to go back to what Chad said. We should be very vocal at our dis pleasure of the DFO ramming this experimental BS down our throats. NO ONE wants this, yet they are moving foward. I am not sure if its doable but we should get that kicked out as a part of the deal.
They are moving on with this and do not care.
They are moving on with this and do not care.
lorneparker1
Banned
So we should just shut up then and accept it? Sounds like the status quo. Its that attitude that drives me insane!! Oh well we tried, lets just give up. Oh well we tried lets just give in. FACK THAT> ok, i am banning myself from SFBC for the rest of the night as i can feel the rage building.
Lorne
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SerengetiGuide
Well-Known Member
Why shouldn't I be able to fill my freezer pre season ? This is the only chance I have to catch fish for my winter as well...just because I'm a guide doesn't mean I don't like to enjoy halibut and salmon over the winter. I eat it quite often while out in Ottawa actually.
Derby
Crew Member
Come on..really.....
searun
Well-Known Member
Lorne, you might actually want to read the catch data and see for yourself when most rec anglers catch their fish - its July/Aug. What actually benefits guides is being able to fish early season before the main salmon season, and to get 2 per day and be done early - that stretches our overall season out. I personally do not agree with front loading the season as it only benefits a few at a cost to the many. What you appear to be advocating is self serving - cuts out average Joe Canadian who wants to travel here for their summer vacation with their kids. Front loading the season is great for those of us who live here and want to attract guests into our shoulder season - selfish approach in my mind. You can read between any lines you want with what ever bs you want to sling....just don't try to guess at my motives.
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
Really, you should check it out. Ask the DFO rep.
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
So you want a season that goes from June to September?
This is not about getting more quota this is about how to divide up the pie for all.
What if the numbers next season go down again?
As you say you need the numbers by area. What then, cut them back so other areas get more to make it fair?
If the area you fish in gets 25% of the fish lets cut it back to 10 % to be fair to the other areas?
What about giving an area a time quota due to the amount of fish they catch. Say only open it for a month for halibut?
What about no guiding for halibut in the month of August, that will cut back the numbers?
Just thinking outside of the box.
Actually, opening the season early has nil impact on the length of the season. The catch distribution graphs over the years show that the overall hali catch until June is pretty much negligible - well under 10% of the rec quota, yet provides important opportunities for locals and early tourists. For that reason arguing for a late season start is nonsense and unnecessarily penalizes certain regions, anglers and businesses.
Fish Assassin
Crew Member
Is this not something that we should have been all over for the last 6 months? Seems to me that last year by the time we got our s..t together it was already set in stone. Is there enough time to make the changes that need to be done before its all ready in print and to late to change?
Derby
Crew Member
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Derby
Crew Member
This is why it is being done in the fall verses the spring time in hopes to allow imput for all the sport sectors
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
A prime example of why using politics trumps all.you right as alway......
Everywhere they had a meeting on this they were told no. They decided to ignore what they were told and do what their masters told them.
The only way they listen is through politics.
The other groups understand this and use it.
Fish Assassin
Crew Member
Just seems like a late start. We don't need to be late to the table again and be told to see if there can be any changes the following year again.
Islandgirl
Well-Known Member
The bulk of the halibut is caught during July and August.
To stay within our allocation it is those months that need to be restricted.
Make it like prawning, only open for half the month for both July and August.,
That may even mean there is enough quota left in the water to have a full september season. Something we have not had for the last 2 years and that would make the guiding sector happy.
Derby
Crew Member
Last year was a late start...... I believe we are doing it in a timely fashion this year..but we"ll see... you just never know what gets thrown in the mix.....
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