Radar Reflector

quote:Originally posted by SerengetiGuide

Ya...I dunno, reason I ask is cause I just read something a guy said online about putting it in his cabin in his fiberglass boat and it still working fine...doesn't sound right to me...but I'm not really all that fluent on radar reflectors lol

www.serengetifishingcharters.com

I assume you are talking about the reflector ? A reflector will work in a fiberglass boat cabin but not as good as being free of obstruction and better to be as high up off the water as possible as it will reflect to a longer distance if higher up. I also suspect materials inside the cabin will somewhat interfere further. As far as the radar goes however, your reflector would be below the beam of the radar if it was in the cabin so could work depending on how bad the cabin itself was obstructing.
 
Hello SerengetiGuide--Dave Dickson of the John D.
I was told by the electronic experts in the Bay Area that the radar reflector should not be on the same plane as the beam as it will cause a dead spot. I used a regular base for antennas and then a 24 in stainless steel rod with the reflector on top--no problems, others have said that on radar the boat really stands out as bright image while others without are sometimes hard to read. Will be up in mid-june, will talk to you then. Good luck and great fishing.
 
quote:Originally posted by SerengetiGuide

it should have a 360 degree view no?? Like if there is fiberglass in front of it in some way it will block it??

www.serengetifishingcharters.com

Having NOTHING in front of the Radar antenna is best, but fibreglass is fairly transparent, and is your best bet if you have to put a mast nearby to get a radar reflector or other antenna above your radar dome.

In my case, my Radar dome sits on top of a rack amidships. Ther is also a VHF antenna off to the starboard side, and my GPS antenna off to port side.

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When I bought the boat, I told them to extend the mast on the GPS antenna for this very reason. I wanted it above the radar dome level.


Jim's Fishing Charters
www.JimsFishing.com
http://www.youtube.com/user/Sushihunter250

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Problem is I can't put the reflector higher than the dome as if I did when we trailer the boat the reflector would be so high that it would be nearing electrical wires...plus I'm sure it'd look pretty funny/ugly to have it up higher than the rest with rod. But if that's the only thing to do....

www.serengetifishingcharters.com
 
quote:Originally posted by SerengetiGuide

Problem is I can't put the reflector higher than the dome as if I did when we trailer the boat the reflector would be so high that it would be nearing electrical wires...plus I'm sure it'd look pretty funny/ugly to have it up higher than the rest with rod. But if that's the only thing to do....
Dave, that’s not the only thing to do.
You are talking about the Pursuit or Grady. Have you even checked to see the signatures and how those boats show on radar? You have enough stainless steel, metal and other material on those boats, they both will probably already light up like a Christmas tree!

If it were me, I would buy a VHF ratchet mount and mount it just like the GPS on the Pursuit (including height), and right beside the VHF antenna or GPS, (either side of either) and be done with it! There is no way I would worry about any interference from anything on those boats, except keeping it out of the radar beam. And the only reason there is so it won’t interfere with the radar, by giving you a blind spot! When trailering just lower it, like your VHF Antenna.

If you want take both boats out, turn the radar, and check them. Just hold the reflector or tape it where you want to install it. The reflector “should” provide you a better signature, but don’t be surprised if it don’t, or isn’t much better – goes back to all that stainless steel!

Just in case, maybe this will help?
Your radar puts out about a 20-degree beam above and below its plane, when the plane of your boat changes- the plane of the radar changes with it. The radar unit is actually inside that “fiberglass” dome. Radar is microwaves, microwaves will pass through fiberglass just like your microwave oven… think about those plastics you cook in the microwave. Ever notice they don’t get hot? If they do, it is only from the food, as the microwaves pass through them! Radar is the same microwaves! There is radar reflectors made enclosed in a fiberglass or polyethylene cases, e.g. 'EcoMax'.

Keep in mind what you are trying to accomplish here – that is to “increase” your visibility to another radar unit! I don’t care if you have a frigg’n fiberglass kayak, it will have something on it that a properly installed and operating radar unit will pick up. the only question is when? The purpose of the reflector is to catch those radar microwaves, concentrate that signal, and reflect/deflect it back to the sending unit. That concentrated signal shows up as larger target on the receivers display. All microwave signals are line of site. A kayak (with radar reflector mounted on a 10 pole) “setting” at the bottom of a 12 foot swell, and I am in my boat with the radar mounted 10 feet above the water “setting” at the bottom of the following 12 foot swell - I am not going to see that kayak, with or without a reflector, period - End of subject! Regardless of how great and concentrated that signal - it does not have line of site! Btw… just for the record submarines use radar on top of the water, they use sonar below the water! RADAR sends out electromagnetic waves, while active SONAR transmits acoustic. Microwaves (electromagnetic waves) diminished rapidly in water. That’s why, and only why you would want it high rather just to make it an easier/better target. Those reflectors being “very” effective and they will be picked up anywhere on the water, as long as it has line of site. And, that signal is not going to be any “better” or “worse” if it is at the waterline or 50 feet in the air – as long as it is within the beam of the receiving unit!


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Ours is mounted below the radar dome, sitting on the cabin roof, with a good portion of it below the fiberglass around the edge of the roof. From numerous experiences in fog we are pretty sure it makes us show up well, at a good distance. A cruise ship called us from 4 miles away in thick fog once, to ascertain our intentions.

A key to success: mount the radar reflector in the "catch rain" position - with one of the open corner areas straight up - it's designed to reflect in almost all directions when mounted this way. Don't mount it with one of the plate junctions straight up.

Richard Cook
New Moon (Bounty 257)
"Cruising in a Big Way"
 
Want a simple solution Dave??? Put the reflector on a rod and put it in the rocket launcher when on the water. For trailering--- take it out of the rocket launcher.

You can pay me for the advice with beer later this summer :D

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20ft Alumaweld Intruder
 
you can also just go out on the water with someone, turn on the radar, and have the other person move the reflector around to your considered mounting locations.... see how the radar screen changes


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Hey David, I ran past Parker Marine a couple of days ago and saw the Heather III sitting on their lot..... I could swear I noticed a radar reflector on the top of the hard top in front, on the Starboard side.............

SS

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That's correct, but we had to take it down because that's where the life raft is going...right in the middle of the hardtop behind the radar dome...we told them that, but still mounted it there :( So I just took it off yesterday..and trying to figure out where to mount it.

And ya it does light up well already charlie but we have to have them for TC...kinda like CL's idea...beer eh...:D

www.serengetifishingcharters.com
 
I took an old paint roller handle and attached one of the cheap radar deflectors to it. The thread of the paint handle is the same as the thread on an extendible boat hook I use to grab crab traps. When foggy, I attach the paint handle deflector to the boat hook and raise it as high as it will go and put it into a rocket launcher. I am told I look like a freighter on other's radar. Davis model SD151 is economical and folds up if you want.
 
just to clarify, a radar reflector reflects the signal directly back to the source. its a nifty geometry problem in how this works. fact is, you can mount your reflector anyway you choose and it will work just fine. there is no magic to orientation of the surfaces of the reflector, it works no matter what, signal in, signal out at the same angle. the key is to have it exposed to all points of the compass. even if its not that high in the air, a reflector is going to insure that others can 'see' you.
 
You might wish to Google "Echomaster User's Guide" and check out instructions to mount in the "Catch Rain" position for best results, on page 11. More than one study of radar reflector effectiveness agrees.



Richard Cook
New Moon (Bounty 257)
"Cruising in a Big Way"
 
interesting read, thanks, now all i have to do is figure out how to stop the boat from rocking so the angle stays 'correct' :D
 
This is an interesting thread. I have a question about the different types of reflectors. Which one is best for us sports fishers. I got one of those emergency gold plated cardboard ones that slot together into a sphere for just in case. But thinking maybe I should do something a little more robust like the cylinders ones someone on here mentioned strapping to your VHF antennae. DO you think this is a better solution yeilding a better signature?
 
any reflector you mount is better than no reflector. the tube reflector i picked up at trotac is about 3" in diameter and 24" long. it is too heavy to fasten to your VHF antenna so i bungie it in place where there is a round the compass view, probably not the best but its there and it reflects [8D] if i were to mount a stalk with a ratchet, it would have to be at minimum 36" tall to clear the radar so i went with a solution that made the most sense on my boat.

the round ones you see were made for sailboats to mount in the rigging way up high. i know one guy who mounted this on a bend fiberglass shaft that he fit into his rocket launcher, slick mount and yet another idea.
 
I was too cheap to buy the nice tube type of reflector but my multi peice round aluminum one snaps together quickly. It is stored in the fully put together position and in my bow storage on my 17 footer. If it gets foggy I pull it out and attach it to a 7-8' aluminum pole using two bolts and butterfy nuts and then slip it into in an extra rod holder tilted strait up. Takes less that 2 minutesd to set up . It then is situated about 10-11' off the water. While it sits in my bow low to the water it still functions as a reflector but I assume better signal deflection when its up sitting in proper position and at 10-11 feet off water.
 
I wouldn't - Not on the bow! Very much might interfere with your radar?? That could create a "hugh" blind spot???

If I were to do anything like that... it would be in the aft of the boat, not the bow! I am one of those guys that kind-of really likes to see "all" around me, but if I were to give up something (while running on plane) it would be behind me - not what's in front of me! :)
 
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