fish brain
Crew Member
I'm not too smrt.
Marinas have to sell E0 gas, but gas stations selling marked gas that will be used in boats do not? Is this what this says?
Coop marked gas with ethanol.
- Thread starter TinnyTime
- Start date
Marinas have to sell E0 gas, but gas stations selling marked gas that will be used in boats do not? Is this what this says?
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
Marinas do not "have to sell" EO but the opportunity is available to them. The distributors handle calculating the compliance requirements for reporting.
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
All gasoline begins as ethanol content zero. Ethanol is blended in later to satisfy government regulations. For distributors, it's only an extra bit of bookkeeping to supply marinas with premium E0, that they are well-compensated for.I think the tough part will be finding a wholesale supplier of ethanol free fuel. Surely it will become a specialty product and you know what that means.
ziggy
Well-Known Member
I can see your point, however already Co Op and Columbia fuels, who I believe receive fuel from Parklands Refinery have said it’s no longer available. Also while I can see there might be exceptions to the “Clean air Act” I can’t see something like like Rec boating being exempt at least for long. Man 10 minutes to type this
Max123
Well-Known Member
If so, that's great news. Just to confirm I am looking at the right law - I was looking at the Greenhouse Gas Reduction (Renewable and Low Carbon Fuel Requirement) Act - and section 3(4) is not the same as you list above. The law was recently updated in December 2023, and earlier versions were repealed.
I'm no expert on Provincial law, but I couldn't find the text listed above on the bclaws website.
Max123
Well-Known Member
I looked at this a bit closer - the law cited by @Foxsea is from Ontario: 535/05 Greener Gasoline - Bio Based Requirement for Gasoline. However, this was replaced in 2020 by 663/20 Cleaner Transportation Fuels - Renewable Content Requirements. This still has as similar exemption for marine / aviation / off-road use (Still just talking about Ontario - so not relevant for us).
The BC reg doesn't seem to a similar exemption and they are even phasing in a requirement for Jet fuel starting in 2028. There are some fairly complicated volume formulas, so maybe individual marinas are able to sneak under the limit for a while.
Here's the Federal Reg:
Here's BC's:
One could be forgiven for thinking that the government 'intentionally' makes this stuff impossible to read/interpret... What a mess for the recreational boater.
The BC reg doesn't seem to a similar exemption and they are even phasing in a requirement for Jet fuel starting in 2028. There are some fairly complicated volume formulas, so maybe individual marinas are able to sneak under the limit for a while.
Here's the Federal Reg:
Here's BC's:
Renewable and Low Carbon Fuels
About the policies and standards established by the Renewable & Low Carbon Fuel Requirements Regulation.
www2.gov.bc.ca
One could be forgiven for thinking that the government 'intentionally' makes this stuff impossible to read/interpret... What a mess for the recreational boater.
Capt. Jack
Member
Me too!
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the correction. It is a mess and moreso considering that the provinces make this stuff up as well. Here's another ArriveCan fiasco.I looked at this a bit closer - the law cited by @Foxsea is from Ontario: 535/05 Greener Gasoline - Bio Based Requirement for Gasoline. However, this was replaced in 2020 by 663/20 Cleaner Transportation Fuels - Renewable Content Requirements. This still has as similar exemption for marine / aviation / off-road use (Still just talking about Ontario - so not relevant for us).
The BC reg doesn't seem to a similar exemption and they are even phasing in a requirement for Jet fuel starting in 2028. There are some fairly complicated volume formulas, so maybe individual marinas are able to sneak under the limit for a while.
Here's the Federal Reg:
Here's BC's:
Renewable and Low Carbon Fuels
About the policies and standards established by the Renewable & Low Carbon Fuel Requirements Regulation.www2.gov.bc.ca
One could be forgiven for thinking that the government 'intentionally' makes this stuff impossible to read/interpret... What a mess for the recreational boater.
Saxe Point
Well-Known Member
If I am at a marina that has marked, I’ll definitely buy it. If not, I’ll buy regular and throw in some seafoam from time to time. Not worth worrying about. As I said in a previous post, the key to solving the ethanol problem is to not let it sit. So I’m going to fish more and run my boat more.
TinnyTime
Active Member
My tank is 130L.... some fuel will end up sitting for a long time
Saxe Point
Well-Known Member
Mine is 137 L and I’ll leave it close to empty if I’m not going to be fishing, say December, January and February, but I’ll add stabilizer and ethanol treatment for this period. But I find i go through a fair bit the rest of the year and the gas never stays in there long. Of course it depends on boat size, distances covered etc. But I mostly run my 18 foot Hourtston (115 Yamaha 4 stroke) from Sooke to Otter and Sheringham Points and back and my fuel gets used up pretty quickly. Trolling on my kicker uses so little that it feels like I could troll forever on a tank.
In a nutshell, I don’t see the loss of ethanol free marked at land based gas stations as being a big problem.
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
The "...loss of ethanol-free marked..." is a problem for the same reasons that forced Transport Canada to ban ethanol in Av-gas. But more than that, it's another symptom of the political disease created by letting the likes of addled Greta Thunberg and the Gen Z kids dictate policies. We willingly allow a vocal 5% to run our country while we nice Canadians sit by and suck it up. Meanwhile in Europe, p.o.'d farmers shut countries down. At least send a harsh letter to the usual suspects.
Saxe Point
Well-Known Member
It’s obviously a problem for you, and part of a much bigger political problem in your view.
Max123
Well-Known Member
I'm against the ethanol requirement, but for totally different reasons. I think its just bad science. Ethanol is generally produced from crops like corn. Corn, which requires nitrogen fertilizer which is generally produced from massive quantities of natural gas and electricity. Ethanol crops displace food crops and every added acre of land needed for ethanol crops comes from somewhere - leading to either deforestation or the loss of prairie grasslands. In addition, fertilizer runoff is one of the main sources of environmental degradation in river estuaries (massive algae blooms leading to ocean dead zones).
In short, even if the math pencils out slightly in favor of ethanol in terms of net carbon into the atmosphere - it comes with other environmental externalities that really make me question the overall benefit. I don't know if ethanol is just a massive farm subsidy in disguise - but its certainly not good climate policy. The fact that ethanol is no good for my outboard is only a minor thing - and frankly, if that were the only reason, I'd suck it up.
I can't see that as the actual gas producers no longer offer it. I was told they all have stopped straight gas as of Oct 1st/23
On top of stabilizers start up your motors more often when sitting not being used especially if a carbed engine. You want to clear the float bowls and jets of the older fuel before the ethanol begins to seperate out and then gum up the jets. Run up motors on muffs long enough to come up to temp and burn the fuel from carbs, filters and fuel lines. You will also be adding a fresh film of oil to bearings, cylinder walls etc and preventing surface rust or pitting during the damp winter months.
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
These things are problems for all thinking people. They do not magically resolve themselves or disappear with complacency.
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
You have inaccurate information. Don't accept it. Just call a few of your favorite marinas, as I did.
