Conservation Measures for Northern and Southern BC Chinook Salmon and Southern Resident Killer Whale

[wildmanyeah]

From the PSF Magazine:

 

[Admin]

Cleaned this up for the last time...read the post from Sunday and stay on topic.

 

[Whitebuck]

Where would you like me to post about illegal netting?

 

[Floater]

Could we make a thread titled "The abuses by FN of their legal right to fish"? It seems that every time someone mentions FN abusing the system we are reminded to stay on topic,,,, so would we be OK to make it the topic of a Thread. We are so often reminded by some on this forum that they have a legal right (no problem with that from me and many others) but we are just as often accused of being racist when someone points out just how much the boundaries of this right is pushed. Just asking,,not trying to start a fight but rather a conversation where we could hear both sides from people that are more knowledgable on the topic than many of us.

I get the feeling we aren’t supposed to talk about this. Being polite Canadians and all.

 

[Floater]

Where would you like me to post about illegal netting?

Start a thread.

I wouldn’t make it solely about FN poaching because I couldn’t care less about the racial background of someone raping the resource in question.

 

[Capilano]

Where would you like me to post about illegal netting?

You guys just don't get it. Besides a few of your fellow merry-men members here, who is your audience? Do you really think continued bitching here is going to fix anything? If you do, then you are delusional at best.

You want to things to change, get off this forum and start writing letters, using social media, contacting the news media, attend meetings. Otherwise you are just wasting time here as outside this forum, no one is reading this and you, using this forum as a soapbox for your moaning and bitching is all for nothing.

I know a reporter that works for a major news outlet here. You want to talk to her, I might be able to arrange - but you will need to use your real name as you will not be able to hide behind your screen name of "WhiteBuck" et al...

 

[Admin]

Could we make a thread titled "The abuses by FN of their legal right to fish"? It seems that every time someone mentions FN abusing the system we are reminded to stay on topic,,,, so would we be OK to make it the topic of a Thread. We are so often reminded by some on this forum that they have a legal right (no problem with that from me and many others) but we are just as often accused of being racist when someone points out just how much the boundaries of this right is pushed. Just asking,,not trying to start a fight but rather a conversation where we could hear both sides from people that are more knowledgable on the topic than many of us.

@Newf, there is already a lengthy thread in the Conservation forum regarding First Nation's fishing rights that you can check out and comment on.

I get the feeling we aren’t supposed to talk about this. Being polite Canadians and all.

You are free to talk about anything you want in Canada but how you say it is very important. When derogatory terms, generalizations, accusations of activities that can't or have not been proven to be illegal, and remarks that defame a person or group of people can all lead to issues for the individual posting and us as the provider of this platform. So, as stated numerous times before, take it up with the proper authorities as loudly as you possibly can if you see illegal activity. Telling people on this forum is of no value unless they have the legal authority to do something about it. As for affecting change, again present ideas here that might actually gain some traction with the government of the day but stop simply bitching about the current state of affairs. Everyone here knows things need to change for Salmon to survive and it isn't a simple one prong approach that is going to be the magic elixir.

 

[Newf]

there is already a lengthy thread in the Conservation forum regarding First Nation's fishing rights that you can check out and comment on.

Thanks Admin,,I will check it out.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Misty MacDuffee and Jeffery Young: Endangered killer whales still await sufficient action
Misty MacDuffee & Jeffery Young

Updated: June 25, 2018

The loss of L92 brings the total number of southern resident killer whales down to 75. Dave Ellifrit / Center for Whale Research

In May, federal Fisheries Minister Dominic LeBlanc and Environment Minister Catherine McKenna declared that “southern resident” killer whales face “imminent threats” to their survival. It was an important announcement that received little attention. Under the Species at Risk Act, the government is obligated to take immediate action to reduce threats and protect critical habitat when a species faces imminent risk of extinction.

With the killer whale known as L92 now presumed dead, the number of southern residents has dropped to 75. This small population has not had a successful calf since 2015. A 2017 study of their birth rates found nearly 70 per cent of pregnancies in the last decade failed. What should be healthy, reproductive members of the population are being lost to apparent starvation.

Southern residents eat mostly Chinook, or spring, salmon, which lie at the heart of the problem. The whales face a crisis not just because Chinook numbers are declining, but also because Chinook are much smaller than they once were, smaller females carry fewer eggs, and Chinook historically returned from March through to the fall. Presently, very few arrive before June. Last year, Fisheries and Oceans Canada’s own test fishery on Fraser River Chinook had the lowest returns in its 35-year history.

Another problem is that noise and disturbance from vessel traffic has made it difficult for whales to hunt, communicate and catch food. Chinook are also a source of contaminants that can compromise the health of whales and their offspring.

In 2017, the Raincoast Conservation Foundation published a population viability analysis indicating southern resident killer whales face a 25-per-cent risk of extinction over the next 100 years if threats to their survival are not reduced.

In late May, the ministers announced fisheries closures in key southern resident foraging areas. Although the news was welcome after a decade of waiting for actions to reduce threats to the whales, the measures only partially address concerns over food availability and disturbances. The areas closed to recreational fisheries do not include a large section of the key foraging area recommended for closure by killer whale scientists. In addition, DFO’s Chinook catch reductions are not intended to increase food for whales; they are simply a response to the fact that Chinook in southern B.C. face a crisis.

As such, DFO’s catch reductions are not designed to ensure that a minimum number of Chinook salmon reach their spawning grounds. We have seen no analysis that indicates DFO will achieve the 25 to 35 per cent reduction in catch they strive for. Even though the feeding areas closed for whales do not allow fishing, the total catch or overall fishing effort is not reduced. Many places adjacent to the closures have no reductions in bag limits over previous years.

The fisheries closures in key feeding areas also need to, at minimum, prohibit whale-watching to reduce noise and disturbance. If fisheries closures are to be effective, then all vessel intrusion should be barred within those zones, not just fishing boats. Stakeholders at the South Coast Integrated Harvest Planning Committee, a federal salmon management advisory process that includes the conservation and fisheries sectors, unanimously agreed that whale-watching of southern residents must be excluded from the feeding areas closed to fishing.

Noise from boats near killer whales disrupts feeding. The population viability analysis found, “Southern Residents reduce feeding activity by 25 per cent around boats. When in the Salish Sea, Southern Residents are in the presence of a vessel an estimated 85 per cent of the time and foraging in the presence of boats an estimated 78 per cent of that time.”

Whale-watching is not the only source of vessel noise and disturbance that must be addressed. Increased shipping traffic associated with the Trans Mountain Pipeline expansion could put the southern residents in the presence of vessels up to 100 per cent of the time as, according to the previous pipeline proponent, Kinder Morgan, tankers would be a “near continuous” presence. Even Kinder Morgan acknowledged that this noise has serious implications for whales that cannot be mitigated.

Although southern resident killer whale numbers have been low in the recent past, they are currently trying to recover in an environment with the lowest prey on historical record, perhaps the highest noise levels, and exceptionally high contaminant burdens. The conclusion they face imminent threats to their survival requires the federal government to take immediate action to reduce those threats, not ramp them up as is being done with the purchase of Trans Mountain. The federal government already faces one killer whale lawsuit for approving the Trans Mountain project and violating the Species at Risk Act. Will the government’s left hand now tell its right hand that it is breaking federal law again?

Misty MacDuffee is a biologist with the Raincoast Conservation Foundation’s Wild Salmon Program; Jeffery Young is the senior science and policy analyst with the David Suzuki Foundation.

 

[Gong Show]

I listened to Misty on the CBC yesterday I think.
It is no surprise that these groups need slick marketing and social media campaigns after hearing her speak.
She had a tough time staying on topic while blaming everything for the decline.

It reminds me of Pol Pot/Khmer Rouge and taking the nation back to year zero.
I never thought these crack pots would be gunning to run the asylum, and yet, here we are.

 

[profisher]

Funny how so far the whales are spending very little time foraging in the refuge areas.

 

[seascene]

I listened to Misty on the CBC yesterday I think.
It is no surprise that these groups need slick marketing and social media campaigns after hearing her speak.
She had a tough time staying on topic while blaming everything for the decline.

It reminds me of Pol Pot/Khmer Rouge and taking the nation back to year zero.
I never thought these crack pots would be gunning to run the asylum, and yet, here we are.

You are firing blanks. You have said nothing. The "crack pots" inherited Super Natural BC and drove into Super Depleted BC.

 

[Michael kirk]

Regarding the FN rights to fish, I support it, however with a caveat or two. Do you think the founding fathers of our Southern neighbors had AR’s in mind when the 2nd amendment was drafted and ratified in the 18th century, of course not, they were contemplating keeping a militia (the populace) armed with muzzleloaders and flintlocks. They couldn’t imagine a future where firearms rattling off hundreds of rounds per second, would be used to murder countless people, including hundreds of children. This begs the question, what was being contemplated during the negotiations between FN’s and the crown’s representatives. I can assure you, not nylon nets, gas engines, refrigeration etc., so the status quo has evolved beyond the initial intent and spirit of the treaties, IMO. Is this for the best or not, I guess it depends on your perspective. Treaties, like tax law are often grey and there is a fair amount of interpretation involved, I think that interpretation depends on the public sentiment of the day and how native friendly the current Federal governent want to appear.

I personally have no problem with the FN’s using modern day technology as long as there is compliance and ultimately enforcement with penalties, if laws are broken. This is not happening on land or water at the moment, if you are native, you are virtually untouchable, when it comes to wildlife harvesting. My friend’s brother was an RCMP officer around Williams Lake and he was a native liaison officer (yes tough posting), when the natives blocked the road West of Williams Lake on the way to the coast, the directive from Ottawa, was to keep the the white man away and leave the natives to their roadblock. What would been the outcome if a bunch of hunters and fisherman blocking that same road, not allowing the natives to travel East toward Williams Lake? Probably faces in the dirt and then hand cuffs with a criminal record.

Regardless of race, Caucasian, Native, Asian etc. there will always be a segment of any population that are dirt bags and only follow laws when being observed. This is the crux of the problem, it just takes a few scum bags to destroy an entire salmon run or wildlife population. So, a small percentage of natives can now and for the foreseeable future harvest whenever and whatever they want, with impunity. I don’t believe we should be pointing fingers at the natives for trying to enforce their treaty rights, but we should be holding the government accountable for allowing this salmon situation to deteriorate to where we are now. We are all Canadians and when we break the law, we should all be held responsible for our actions, treaties or not.

 

[Fishalot]

Does anybody have reports that have evidence that a lack of food is causing starvation in SKRW whales? If indeed a whale recently died its carcass would be very useful for examination if its a lack of food or toxins etc that is the issue.

 

[Gong Show]

You are firing blanks. You have said nothing. The "crack pots" inherited Super Natural BC and drove into Super Depleted BC.

Not really shooting Tex.
Just made a connection between a reported article and what I heard on the CBC.
Sorry if I offended.

 

[california]

Regarding the FN rights to fish, I support it, however with a caveat or two. Do you think the founding fathers of our Southern neighbors had AR’s in mind when the 2nd amendment was drafted and ratified in the 18th century, of course not, they were contemplating keeping a militia (the populace) armed with muzzleloaders and flintlocks. They couldn’t imagine a future where firearms rattling off hundreds of rounds per second, would be used to murder countless people, including hundreds of children. This begs the question, what was being contemplated during the negotiations between FN’s and the crown’s representatives. I can assure you, not nylon nets, gas engines, refrigeration etc., so the status quo has evolved beyond the initial intent and spirit of the treaties, IMO. Is this for the best or not, I guess it depends on your perspective. Treaties, like tax law are often grey and there is a fair amount of interpretation involved, I think that interpretation depends on the public sentiment of the day and how native friendly the current Federal governent want to appear.

I personally have no problem with the FN’s using modern day technology as long as there is compliance and ultimately enforcement with penalties, if laws are broken. This is not happening on land or water at the moment, if you are native, you are virtually untouchable, when it comes to wildlife harvesting. My friend’s brother was an RCMP officer around Williams Lake and he was a native liaison officer (yes tough posting), when the natives blocked the road West of Williams Lake on the way to the coast, the directive from Ottawa, was to keep the the white man away and leave the natives to their roadblock. What would been the outcome if a bunch of hunters and fisherman blocking that same road, not allowing the natives to travel East toward Williams Lake? Probably faces in the dirt and then hand cuffs with a criminal record.

Regardless of race, Caucasian, Native, Asian etc. there will always be a segment of any population that are dirt bags and only follow laws when being observed. This is the crux of the problem, it just takes a few scum bags to destroy an entire salmon run or wildlife population. So, a small percentage of natives can now and for the foreseeable future harvest whenever and whatever they want, with impunity. I don’t believe we should be pointing fingers at the natives for trying to enforce their treaty rights, but we should be holding the government accountable for allowing this salmon situation to deteriorate to where we are now. We are all Canadians and when we break the law, we should all be held responsible for our actions, treaties or not.

I dont know where you are from but you are completely ignorant of BC history. There were only two treaties signed with the FN in BC the Douglas treaty covering the Victoria area, and treaty 8 covering land in the peace river. That's it. There was no intent because there were almost no treaties. In the absence of treaties the courts have decided native rights. Most major cases have been in the last few decades.

 

[Capilano]

Regarding the FN rights to fish, I support it, however with a caveat or two.

I dont know where you are from but you are completely ignorant of BC history. There were only two treaties signed with the FN in BC the Douglas treaty covering the Victoria area, and treaty 8 covering land in the peace river. That's it. There was no intent because there were almost no treaties. In the absence of treaties the courts have decided native rights. Most major cases have been in the last few decades.

You guys should move your conversation to a more appropriate thread which Admin mentioned yesterday...

http://www.sportfishingbc.com/forum...supreme-court-ruling.69805/page-6#post-881867

 

[Michael kirk]

Yes CA, I am ignorant and obviously touched a nerve, which nerve was it? Everybody has access to the internet and can quote history of treaties, I believe 11 in total in Canada, starting in 1871. I wasn’t thinking in terms of only B.C. But Canada in general, I guess I could of clarified that. I personally spoke to a lawyer over various issues regarding treaty rights in Canada. She had recently completed treaty negotiations in New Zealand between the Maori and the Kiwi government and was now coming to Canada to work on behalf of the FN’s. She was the one who explained to me the grey area of treaty rights. If you want to play semantics with the wording of native rights vs treaty rights, go for it, but most in Canada view these as interchangeable terms, either way they are all open to interpretation, sometimes by intentional vague wording and other times sloppy wording, that can be taken advantage of.

 

[Michael kirk]

Yes CA, I am ignorant and obviously touched a nerve, which nerve was it? Everybody has access to the internet and can quote history of treaties, I believe 11 in total in Canada, starting in 1871. I wasn’t thinking in terms of only B.C. But Canada in general, I guess I could of clarified that. I personally spoke to a lawyer over various issues regarding treaty rights in Canada. She had recently completed treaty negotiations in New Zealand between the Maori and the Kiwi government and was now coming to Canada to work on behalf of the FN’s. She was the one who explained to me the grey area of treaty rights. If you want to play semantics with the wording of native rights vs treaty rights, go for it, but most in Canada view these as interchangeable terms, either way they are all open to interpretation, sometimes by intentional vague wording and other times sloppy wording, that can be taken advantage of.

Will do Capilano.

 

[ericl]

Does anybody have reports that have evidence that a lack of food is causing starvation in SKRW whales? If indeed a whale recently died its carcass would be very useful for examination if its a lack of food or toxins etc that is the issue.

If you are interested enough, there is a wealth of info on this subject on the internet. It is quite fragmented with no one single source of info. Not all of the 3 pods that compose the SRKW population exhibit the same migration behavior. The L pod goes as far south as mid-California in pursuit of Chinook in the winter (Sacramento river has a run of winter Chinook & many of the runs down that way do not migrate north).
The conclusions & hypothesis we hear from the science side probably come from diverse sources of information. I believe the fin fish closures are more of an experiment than an action backed by strong science. It would have been better to exclude all vessels IMO.