Trans Mountain pipeline work destroyed salmon habitat

[browningmirage]

I here people talking about the emissions caused by the use of fossil fuels from the pipelines, but at the same time they seem to be ignoring that the port of tsawwassen is the largest exporter of coal in North America witch a mass majority is American coal ,why are the pipeline haters turning a blind eye to this ? These ships exporting this coal are disrupting our orcas and at the same time contributing to the largest emitter of co2 in the world ,I wonder if they know this and choose to ignore or are they just so narrow minded they don’t see it,To the wood burning hypocrites you make me sick along with this planet

We aren't ignoring it. Its known. But how do you start dismantling and shifting to cleaner sources while going whole hog on building more capacity? It's like a boat full of holes going down slowly...while a guy goes crazy and is in the engine room drilling more bigger holes. It doesnt really help your situation until you deal with the crazy guy making new holes.

Twinning the pipe wont reduce coal exports, it wont reduce the number of coal boats. It will increase (by 400 a year) large tanker traffic, along with support vessels, pilot boats, etc. Southern residents will face more vessel traffic, their populations will continue to decline and we will be subject to even more chinook and area closures. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.

And from a ghg perspective, woodstoves are carbon neutral, provided you burn wood that was already dead and not specifically cut down to burn. Air quality there are certainly issues, but CO2 would be otherwise released during the decomposition of already dead wood.

 

[Jwolfe]

Wow your narrow mind looked past the fact that coal is dirtier then bitumen even if it’s not refined https://m.huffingtonpost./andrew-weaver/eu-law-oil-canada_b_1288264.html

What do you think China will do with Bitumen? The winds blow back and we get to breath the nasty crap in the air. Take a look. No Thanks

 

[Jwolfe]

We aren't ignoring it. Its known. But how do you start dismantling and shifting to cleaner sources while going whole hog on building more capacity? It's like a boat full of holes going down slowly...while a guy goes crazy and is in the engine room drilling more bigger holes. It doesnt really help your situation until you deal with the crazy guy making new holes.

Twinning the pipe wont reduce coal exports, it wont reduce the number of coal boats. It will increase (by 400 a year) large tanker traffic, along with support vessels, pilot boats, etc. Southern residents will face more vessel traffic, their populations will continue to decline and we will be subject to even more chinook and area closures. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.

And from a ghg perspective, woodstoves are carbon neutral, provided you burn wood that was already dead and not specifically cut down to burn. Air quality there are certainly issues, but CO2 would be otherwise released during the decomposition of already dead wood.

We aren't ignoring it. Its known. But how do you start dismantling and shifting to cleaner sources while going whole hog on building more capacity? It's like a boat full of holes going down slowly...while a guy goes crazy and is in the engine room drilling more bigger holes. It doesnt really help your situation until you deal with the crazy guy making new holes.

Twinning the pipe wont reduce coal exports, it wont reduce the number of coal boats. It will increase (by 400 a year) large tanker traffic, along with support vessels, pilot boats, etc. Southern residents will face more vessel traffic, their populations will continue to decline and we will be subject to even more chinook and area closures. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.

And from a ghg perspective, woodstoves are carbon neutral, provided you burn wood that was already dead and not specifically cut down to burn. Air quality there are certainly issues, but CO2 would be otherwise released during the decomposition of already dead wood.

400 a year, what about whale watching boats chasing them around every single day why are you ignoring this ?you don’t think this disrupts the whales feeding ,have you ever been on a whale watching tour ,half the time whales dive and disperse imagine the salmon near surface I’m sure their not bothered or change their rout I can agree for different reasons that we should not be sending raw bitumen unrefined like our raw logs across the pond but I don’t like how a majority of people turn a blind eye to the issues affecting our salmon and whales that are present

 

[ziggy]

We aren't ignoring it. Its known. But how do you start dismantling and shifting to cleaner sources while going whole hog on building more capacity? It's like a boat full of holes going down slowly...while a guy goes crazy and is in the engine room drilling more bigger holes. It doesnt really help your situation until you deal with the crazy guy making new holes.

Twinning the pipe wont reduce coal exports, it wont reduce the number of coal boats. It will increase (by 400 a year) large tanker traffic, along with support vessels, pilot boats, etc. Southern residents will face more vessel traffic, their populations will continue to decline and we will be subject to even more chinook and area closures. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.

And from a ghg perspective, woodstoves are carbon neutral, provided you burn wood that was already dead and not specifically cut down to burn. Air quality there are certainly issues, but CO2 would be otherwise released during the decomposition of already dead wood.

I wonder why there is so little talk of controlling American Tanker traffic that uses the exact same traffic lanes as would any Canadian traffic? It just seems to me the Whale problem is a binational one, until it comes to restrictions on Tankers, then its suddenly just a Canadian problem. I find the environmental movement (funded and supported generally on both sides of the border)seems pretty two faced when it comes to Tanker traffic, as does Washington’s Governor. I guess I’m being cynical but I can see where people get the impression that it could be more about protecting Market Share than protecting the environment.

 

[browningmirage]

400 a year, what about whale watching boats chasing them around every single day why are you ignoring this ?you don’t think this disrupts the whales feeding ,have you ever been on a whale watching tour ,half the time whales dive and disperse imagine the salmon near surface I’m sure their not bothered or change their rout I can agree for different reasons that we should not be sending raw bitumen unrefined like our raw logs across the pond but I don’t like how a majority of people turn a blind eye to the issues affecting our salmon and whales that are present

Your perception that others dont think about the big picture is incorrect.

If you dont want to buy into the environmental arguments, how about a solely selfish argument?

Given the evidence, it is clear that vessel traffic is having an impact on southern resident killer whales. More vessel traffic means more impact.

As recreational anglers, we have seen significant changes to our fishery to improve the prospects for SRKW. Ours is an easy industry to point fingers at. Huge numbers of boats (vessel traffic) harvesting their most important prey.

Given an increase in shipping traffic WILL impact SRKW, anglers are shooting themselves in the foot to support further increases in vessel traffic.

The easy group to cut back is the recreational anglers. Make no mistake, if the pipeline goes through, and the SRKW continue to trend negatively, who do you think will see further restrictions?

Not those associated with the pipeline.

 

[wildmanyeah]

I wonder why there is so little talk of controlling American Tanker traffic that uses the exact same traffic lanes as would any Canadian traffic? It just seems to me the Whale problem is a binational one, until it comes to restrictions on Tankers, then its suddenly just a Canadian problem. I find the environmental movement (funded and supported generally on both sides of the border)seems pretty two faced when it comes to Tanker traffic, as does Washington’s Governor. I guess I’m being cynical but I can see where people get the impression that it could be more about protecting Market Share than protecting the environment.

Its based on a report that was done and put out by some ENGO, our favorite Raincoast conservation

https://www.raincoast.org/trans-mountain-pipeline/

Its also part of a global movement tho to completely try and stop the Alberta tar sands, Strangle off the production and save the planet

Andre weaver green party leader has been trying to limit it for years

http://www.andrewweavermla.ca/2014/02/09/british-columbia-alberta-tar-sands/

Even popular scientists like Bill Nye people in the states are against it, and are out their against it

https://canoe.com/news/national/bil...mate-change-prods-over-morgan-kinder-pipeline

 

[walleyes]

We aren't ignoring it. Its known. But how do you start dismantling and shifting to cleaner sources while going whole hog on building more capacity? It's like a boat full of holes going down slowly...while a guy goes crazy and is in the engine room drilling more bigger holes. It doesnt really help your situation until you deal with the crazy guy making new holes.

Twinning the pipe wont reduce coal exports, it wont reduce the number of coal boats. It will increase (by 400 a year) large tanker traffic, along with support vessels, pilot boats, etc. Southern residents will face more vessel traffic, their populations will continue to decline and we will be subject to even more chinook and area closures. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.

And from a ghg perspective, woodstoves are carbon neutral, provided you burn wood that was already dead and not specifically cut down to burn. Air quality there are certainly issues, but CO2 would be otherwise released during the decomposition of already dead wood.

Yah they are ignoring the problem and bringing more of it in daily,, hypocrites,, did you read my earlier link I posted, here's another for you to read. Suing an energy firm is not doing something about it all while demanding more of the product they produce. Its complete insanity man.

https://boereport.com/2019/01/30/te...-council-on-climate-change-lawsuit-ambitions/

 

[terrin]

Wow your narrow mind looked past the fact that coal is dirtier then bitumen even if it’s not refined https://m.huffingtonpost./andrew-weaver/eu-law-oil-canada_b_1288264.html

The Forum rules disallow personal attacks FYI. From an environmental point of view when a ship goes down in the Geargia Straight I would hazard to guess a load of coal lying on the ocean floor is not the same as the Bitumen.

 

[terrin]

Yah they are ignoring the problem and bringing more of it in daily,, hypocrites,, did you read my earlier link I posted, here's another for you to read. Suing an energy firm is not doing something about it all while demanding more of the product they produce. Its complete insanity man.

https://boereport.com/2019/01/30/te...-council-on-climate-change-lawsuit-ambitions/

Insanity is to continue in the same way and expect a better outcome. Actions speak louder than words. https://edmonton.citynews.ca/2019/0...s-cant-abandon-old-wells-supreme-court-rules/

 

[walleyes]

WTH does that have to do with this topic lol. On top of that I fully agree with that ruling as do most people in the province why should we be left to clean up these wells.

No argument from me on that one sorry,, swing and miss for you.

 

[ziggy]

Its based on a report that was done and put out by some ENGO, our favorite Raincoast conservation

https://www.raincoast.org/trans-mountain-pipeline/

Its also part of a global movement tho to completely try and stop the Alberta tar sands, Strangle off the production and save the planet

Andre weaver green party leader has been trying to limit it for years

http://www.andrewweavermla.ca/2014/02/09/british-columbia-alberta-tar-sands/

Even popular scientists like Bill Nye people in the states are against it, and are out their against it

https://canoe.com/news/national/bil...mate-change-prods-over-morgan-kinder-pipeline

Yeah Bill Nye illustrates my point! Here we have a guy with celebrity telling us not to ship oil, meanwhile his homeland is doing exactly what he’s preaching against. Did he lecture Governor Insley or President Trump? Nope not a chance, so the question is why, why is American traffic different? Are ships visiting American ports quieter? Well no? Is the Oil they’re carrying not a potential threat to the environment? Well no? Will not selling our oil on the open market mean it won’t be sourced elsewhere? Well no. Will this make oil from Washington more valuable given the competition is limited? Well probably. Sorry for being a cynic,but I think our environmental organizations are being played! Let’s ask the question why their counterparts across the border are so quiet? Where are the American celebrities complaining against American Tankers from Alaska?

 

[Dave]

This reminds me of the fish farm fight that was started by an American born activist.

 

[Birdsnest]

Yeah Bill Nye illustrates my point! Here we have a guy with celebrity telling us not to ship oil, meanwhile his homeland is doing exactly what he’s preaching against. Did he lecture Governor Insley to President Trump? Nope not a chance, so the question is why, why is American traffic different? Are ships visiting American ports quieter? Well no? Is the Oil they’re carrying not a potential threat to the environment? Well no? Will not selling our oil on the open market mean it won’t be sourced elsewhere? Well no. Will this make oil from Washington more valuable given the competition is limited? Well probably. Sorry for being a cynic,but I think our environmental organizations are being played! Let’s ask the question why their counterparts across the border are so quiet? Where are the American celebrities complaining against American Tankers from Alaska?

Not "Played", Payed! Maybe a better word would be used. But these groups are more than happy to take the money. I support putting and end to this type of US funding in Canada. Clearly it is doing more damage to our economy than it is helping the environment which is THE INTENT!!! Im glad people here are starting to see this clearly.

 

[terrin]

WTH does that have to do with this topic lol. On top of that I fully agree with that ruling as do most people in the province why should we be left to clean up these wells.

No argument from me on that one sorry,, swing and miss for you.

The point is the Province had to go all the way to Supreme Court to get the Oil Industry to pay to clean up after themselves as they did not see it as an obligation. Do you think if the Province had lost (which they did in two lower court rulings) that the Oil Industry would have stepped up to clean up after themselves? I would say not a chance. Similarily in this post they do the least amount that they are compelled while telling us with a straight face how environmentally conscious they are. Rape and pillage then off to the next frontier but we only live on this one planet.

 

[walleyes]

Yes well there are pigs and gluttens in every industry, unfortunately that's human nature. Painting all companies with the same brush is wrong. Every industry has its issues are we to stop all industry. I know you probly would but realistic people realize we need it. Mistakes were made in regulation in a relatively new industry in the big scope of things, hopefully this rectifies the issue. A lot of these wells around the province that are abandoned are still legacy wells from the first wave of drilling that dates back to the 50's and 60's. Do you think the green industry is going to be any different, they are already having issues dealing with battery waste, wait until it kicks in. What do you think is going to happen to all these huge wind farms when they start crapping out and falling apart who's going to clean those up, or will they just stand there and delapitate and be an eye sore. I don't know do you. An oil company is just a company they are entities owned by a collective group of investors. Hedge funds, retirement funds, government retirement funds just comapany entities that were following or better yet getting away with the laws that were in place. As we grow we learn and we make changes hopefully this new regulation can deal with this issue. Just because there were mistakes made doesn't mean we stop growing and stop learning.

 

[wildmanyeah]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=750429132022656

 

[Admin]

Typical of all of these threads, there is almost zero conversation around the original topic. Ending it now before it completely blows up.