KVI your an idiot. If you want to live in a 2 room dirt floor house, work for $8.00 a day and live like a slave..go for it...move to Mexico. Why do you and a few others only mention fuel as the daily cost of business? Ahhh you don't own a business and probably never will...you don't have the balls to work outside the safety net of a steady pay check.
Sooke- the new Mexico
- Thread starter profisher
- Start date
Ripoff
Yeah....and that is probably all you catch is the coho and shakers. Big meat Big fish proven many times over. Like I said cheap old farts like yourself. Dogfish....easy solution but that I will not share. Good luck though in your travels. I would rather spend the buck a piece on hogs than chase teenagers any day sorry.
Yeah....and that is probably all you catch is the coho and shakers. Big meat Big fish proven many times over. Like I said cheap old farts like yourself. Dogfish....easy solution but that I will not share. Good luck though in your travels. I would rather spend the buck a piece on hogs than chase teenagers any day sorry.
Yeah....by the way your right I am not the one that has to slug it out for morning and afternoon charters all summer. I fish for fun cause I can afford it when I want and with whom I want not just pass the rod off to some loser instead of bonking it myself and Mexico sucks but I suppose that is as far as you can afford to go for a week all inclusive 3 star on a guides wage. Best of luck.
lorneparker1
Banned
Kv1 you are a beauty. You talk like you have an oil background..... What is it do exactly?
dfrase
Active Member
Guys,
Love fishing and have a lot of respect for guys who make a living as a guide. But bottom line is that the items you are bitching about are no different than the issues faced by any business owner in today's economy.
You make the choice to run your own business. upside is you decide your schedule and really have no accountability to anyone (except maybe a wife and a business partner). the trade off is you are responsible for bringing in the revenue to keep things going. If you don't like it, then get a job on the other side where you have a boss with a consistent salary and limited time off.
Or... you can stop complaining and find ways to add value to your business.
Rather than thinking like a fisherman and hoping that things will return to the "good ol days", start thinking outside the box. Nothing stays the same and if you don't evolve your business will end up like blockbuster video. Starbucks could put every single coffee shop in the world out of business if all the business owners sounded as miserable and hopeless as some of these guides do... but some rise to the challenge and find ways of leveraging these opportunities.
A few suggestions to think on...and maybe not all great, just thoughts on how to create value.
Leverage other businesses - dress nicely and look sharp, go visit some hotels or restaurants, offer the manager and maybe a few employees a free fishing charter for a morning. Take him out and show him your boat and how professional your operation is.. then see if your businesses can work together. maybe a package for guiding and lodging together at a nice hotel in vic. maybe dins from a nice restaurant can be part of the package. or maybe you can just get a bellman to give a charter pamphlet to any rich albertan who walks through the door. tell the staff you will give them $50 for every referral which books with you.
Do you have a website? do you have a facebook page? twitter account? these are things you need to operate in today's competitive market. your website needs to have video's and testimonials from pleased clients.
Work together - if you have guides you trust to work with, put together group packages. find a niche. maybe you get 2-3 boats who put together packages for corporate events. Find companies with money (lots of them in Vic!) who would like to do an annual fishing derby for their employees. put together a marketing package outlinging the values and costs. teach their employees about the west coast environment. Many companies, like my own, are made up of people from other parts of the world. You don't need to be a marine biologist to educate ppl about our coastal regions. Send the marketing package to 100 companies in town. you get 5 corporate trips and it's worth it. and then book them year after year.
I work as a business consultant and help large companies who are tackling these exact same issues.
If you are unsure how exactly to make any of the above happen, feel free to PM me and i would be happy to give some thoughts on making it happen.
Best of Luck
Dfrase
Love fishing and have a lot of respect for guys who make a living as a guide. But bottom line is that the items you are bitching about are no different than the issues faced by any business owner in today's economy.
You make the choice to run your own business. upside is you decide your schedule and really have no accountability to anyone (except maybe a wife and a business partner). the trade off is you are responsible for bringing in the revenue to keep things going. If you don't like it, then get a job on the other side where you have a boss with a consistent salary and limited time off.
Or... you can stop complaining and find ways to add value to your business.
Rather than thinking like a fisherman and hoping that things will return to the "good ol days", start thinking outside the box. Nothing stays the same and if you don't evolve your business will end up like blockbuster video. Starbucks could put every single coffee shop in the world out of business if all the business owners sounded as miserable and hopeless as some of these guides do... but some rise to the challenge and find ways of leveraging these opportunities.
A few suggestions to think on...and maybe not all great, just thoughts on how to create value.
Leverage other businesses - dress nicely and look sharp, go visit some hotels or restaurants, offer the manager and maybe a few employees a free fishing charter for a morning. Take him out and show him your boat and how professional your operation is.. then see if your businesses can work together. maybe a package for guiding and lodging together at a nice hotel in vic. maybe dins from a nice restaurant can be part of the package. or maybe you can just get a bellman to give a charter pamphlet to any rich albertan who walks through the door. tell the staff you will give them $50 for every referral which books with you.
Do you have a website? do you have a facebook page? twitter account? these are things you need to operate in today's competitive market. your website needs to have video's and testimonials from pleased clients.
Work together - if you have guides you trust to work with, put together group packages. find a niche. maybe you get 2-3 boats who put together packages for corporate events. Find companies with money (lots of them in Vic!) who would like to do an annual fishing derby for their employees. put together a marketing package outlinging the values and costs. teach their employees about the west coast environment. Many companies, like my own, are made up of people from other parts of the world. You don't need to be a marine biologist to educate ppl about our coastal regions. Send the marketing package to 100 companies in town. you get 5 corporate trips and it's worth it. and then book them year after year.
I work as a business consultant and help large companies who are tackling these exact same issues.
If you are unsure how exactly to make any of the above happen, feel free to PM me and i would be happy to give some thoughts on making it happen.
Best of Luck
Dfrase
scott craven
Well-Known Member
Very good post Dfrase.
I totally agree, and you may get some business consultation work at the same time.
I totally agree, and you may get some business consultation work at the same time.
Dfraee...believe me after 26 years in this business and one other I'm well versed in marketing and networking to put my business in a position to succeed. My name and reputation are well know in the local community. I have always provided more bang for the buck than my competitors. Like only the best equipment, video, pics, coffee, pop, bottled water, proper fish bags, proper coolers for shipping. I would like to buy a large ice making machine to hold the fish while on boat and to give the customer a free supply to go home with. I would also like to buy a commercial grade vacuum sealer and offer that service. However another 10K invested right now with so many working to cheaply prevents me from investing any further in this business. It is so bad that I even have to chain and lock my own wheelbarrow that I bought so that I wouldn't have to go searching for a marina one...so that the others don't use it. When the others have mechanical problems they come to me to borrow tools which I carry on board. I'm, not an a-hole so I lend them if I have them..but can't help think who would take the public out on the water without even a basic tool kit to fix minor breakdowns?
KVI - It seem to me you enjoy tweeking the quides and the members on here to get a rise out of them which could quickly put you into the troll category.
There are many other costs with fishing most people don’t think of. I just paid for a 5 year boat survey so that I can get my boat reinsured. Upgrading and replacing rusted out brakes on trailers costs thousands and the standards for trailers/towing and associated costs are higher in BC that other locations including Alberta and Washington State.
For guiding there are the DOT certifications and safety equipment that you won’t see in many countries and the training cost that our government demands. It is not just gas, it is the 40 or 50 thousand to repower your main motors when you blow one up that will kill you and not much depreciates faster than boats or requires more repairs especially in salt water.
I am not a guide but I do use the services of local well respected guides occasionally, most recently this spring to pick up some pointers on Halibut fishing as I am still a newbie in that area. I don’t mind paying a fair price for a good safe boat (I know what it costs to run one) and a quality fishing experience. I also pay to be guided every year in the Campbell River Tyee Pool rowboat sport fishery and those guys earn their money the hard way and are worth every dime they get. I am sure they don’t need to buy exercise equipment.
There are many other costs with fishing most people don’t think of. I just paid for a 5 year boat survey so that I can get my boat reinsured. Upgrading and replacing rusted out brakes on trailers costs thousands and the standards for trailers/towing and associated costs are higher in BC that other locations including Alberta and Washington State.
For guiding there are the DOT certifications and safety equipment that you won’t see in many countries and the training cost that our government demands. It is not just gas, it is the 40 or 50 thousand to repower your main motors when you blow one up that will kill you and not much depreciates faster than boats or requires more repairs especially in salt water.
I am not a guide but I do use the services of local well respected guides occasionally, most recently this spring to pick up some pointers on Halibut fishing as I am still a newbie in that area. I don’t mind paying a fair price for a good safe boat (I know what it costs to run one) and a quality fishing experience. I also pay to be guided every year in the Campbell River Tyee Pool rowboat sport fishery and those guys earn their money the hard way and are worth every dime they get. I am sure they don’t need to buy exercise equipment.
Red Carey
Member
After reading this thread I thought it was winter time. Threads with this much heat usually only occur in Jan-Feb...
Its expensive enough owning your own boat (Break Out Another Thousand). I sold my boat to put my money into other more profitable areas so now I go on 2 or 3 charters each year to put some salmon and halibut into the freezer. The cost of those charters makes the fish a lot less expensive versus the cost of my own boat or the grocery store. I make sure I pick the right guide to have the best potential to put fish in the boat. I have 3 acquaintances that always share the cost and we have a great time with none of the other issues of running your own boat. A few members have stated they have learned the lesson of going with cheap charters and they will not repeat that mistake. The cream always rises to the top!
That being said we do have a democratic government and a free market economy which makes this place we call home a whole lot more stable than 4/5's of the world. I can appreciate the frustration of the top guides with the undercutting but every business has to deal with that as well as the occasional negative economic environment. The strongest will always make it through the difficult economic periods. Profisher has stated that he has been doing this for 26 years which validates my last point.
Canada is not Mexico and Mexico is not Canada. Its the same with any other fishing hotspot inserted into Mexico's spot.
Its expensive enough owning your own boat (Break Out Another Thousand). I sold my boat to put my money into other more profitable areas so now I go on 2 or 3 charters each year to put some salmon and halibut into the freezer. The cost of those charters makes the fish a lot less expensive versus the cost of my own boat or the grocery store. I make sure I pick the right guide to have the best potential to put fish in the boat. I have 3 acquaintances that always share the cost and we have a great time with none of the other issues of running your own boat. A few members have stated they have learned the lesson of going with cheap charters and they will not repeat that mistake. The cream always rises to the top!
That being said we do have a democratic government and a free market economy which makes this place we call home a whole lot more stable than 4/5's of the world. I can appreciate the frustration of the top guides with the undercutting but every business has to deal with that as well as the occasional negative economic environment. The strongest will always make it through the difficult economic periods. Profisher has stated that he has been doing this for 26 years which validates my last point.
Canada is not Mexico and Mexico is not Canada. Its the same with any other fishing hotspot inserted into Mexico's spot.
Ripoff
Yeah....your right I am an idiot after 26 years in the business I just NOW figured out that business is difficult and expensive to run.....ok. I agree though that vacuum packer and ice machine and your own wheelbarrow at 10G's would be a good investment in those 26 years. Just saying. The last few posts were good though I think you just have to understand that you must change with the world not just do the same old thing the same old way and expect to survive in today's economy.
The groupon guy is doing the right thing hacking and slashing to keep the revenue coming in so at least hes out there not in here talking about how great of a internet guide he is.
Yeah....your right I am an idiot after 26 years in the business I just NOW figured out that business is difficult and expensive to run.....ok. I agree though that vacuum packer and ice machine and your own wheelbarrow at 10G's would be a good investment in those 26 years. Just saying. The last few posts were good though I think you just have to understand that you must change with the world not just do the same old thing the same old way and expect to survive in today's economy.
The groupon guy is doing the right thing hacking and slashing to keep the revenue coming in so at least hes out there not in here talking about how great of a internet guide he is.
Well I hope you enjoy subsidizing all these guys when you pay 100% of the income tax you must every year. Because just like shoplifting..that cost is addedto your bill in to cover what they loose. So I guess you should call these guys up and just ask them to at least say thank you for picking up their slack. It's the least they could do for such a good buddy.
Didn't want to jump into this, until you brought up the income taxes.
I know for a fact, most guides show their operations as a break even/loss, so they don't have to pay anyways.
How about te client that pays cash, or the tips that are collected, do they all get reported?
I know for a fact, most guides show their operations as a break even/loss, so they don't have to pay anyways.
How about te client that pays cash, or the tips that are collected, do they all get reported?
If you don't collect the HST and a simple mathematical knows with 100% certainty that the operator is grossing well in excess of 30K (which is when you must collect it) and they don't accept credit cards for payment...what do you think? How else could you show your gross income to be under the 30K when your earn 50 to 60K a year? I'm not including al the under cutters in this category..but there are enough of them. How can I compete with someone who is cheating and using the 12% to further advantage on pricing? My 6hr morning trip at $550.00 is now $616.00 with the tax, while the others are $400 or less for the same trip? As far as any tax goes a product or service should be taxable or not...who you buy that service or product from should not even be apart of the equation.
lorneparker1
Banned
The other part which you left out and is very relevant, is all the TAX free cash jobs done.
Lorne
$1000 cash charter is really $1500 on the books.
A1 Labman that is the truth. Now lets not waste anymore of Fishtofino or Profishers time as I think the Thousand dollar Portland Point Charter phone is ringing with suckers. Why all the fuss for 60 K for 26 years of your life I hope you get a refund at Guide academy because its sounds like there is a lot more stress out there when you should be having fun fishing after retiring....... Oh sorry your still working my mistake. Now that's definitely my last comment Over and OUT. Gotta get me a slab today.....on a herring.
Aces
Well-Known Member
A waste of 15 posts, IMO
BTW fellas. I report all my cash income, somebody has to keep the economy going besides all the oilfield millionaires
Not a millionaire, but I did pay $82.000 in personal income tax last year.
If I was an Oilfield Millionaire, I would have been able to move back home to B.C. and maybe buy that fishing shop in Tofino. LOL
Sorry there KV1, but I never took your side in any of this, your talking out your arse!!!
Seafever
Well-Known Member
Although the old adage " if your info ain't great....then you should run bait" is true to some extent, there are dozens of times when rubber,plastic,vinyl and metal will outfish bait (including "hogs").
If a "hog" is considered to be anything over 35lbs.
Ask any commercial salmon fisherman.
Herring is one choice.......Pilchards and anchovies and squid are another.
The Tyee Club in Campbell river has caught many a hog on plugs......same in the early Tyee Club days in Port Alberni,
where "over 50's" were the norm. The Alaskan plug was a go-to as well as Tee-spoons.
Hogs have been caught on just about every kind of tackle around the coast.
Herring works.........so a do lot of other things......for hogs...
I can afford Herring if I like....should I choose to use them. Or anything else for that matter.
KV1....do you actually spend much time fishing in the ocean?.....
If a "hog" is considered to be anything over 35lbs.
Ask any commercial salmon fisherman.
Herring is one choice.......Pilchards and anchovies and squid are another.
The Tyee Club in Campbell river has caught many a hog on plugs......same in the early Tyee Club days in Port Alberni,
where "over 50's" were the norm. The Alaskan plug was a go-to as well as Tee-spoons.
Hogs have been caught on just about every kind of tackle around the coast.
Herring works.........so a do lot of other things......for hogs...
I can afford Herring if I like....should I choose to use them. Or anything else for that matter.
KV1....do you actually spend much time fishing in the ocean?.....
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