response to Tips up's question from the halibut poll thread.

Jencourt

Well-Known Member
Any response to this question:

"If the TAC was divided amongst people who are FISHING there would be plenty to go around. Agree?"

Thanks
Tips

I did not whant to steer the thread in a new direction as it is about the poll.


The problem I see with this statement is that regardless of whether those persons commercially fishing the 85 percent own it or lease it. those fishing it are still fishing all or most of the 85 percent anyway.

I agree fully it should be shared amongst the rec and the active fisherman of the commie sector. The fact still remains that it will take a much larger portion of the Canadian TAC than our current 15% to get us out of this situation . That TAC allocation can only come from the 85%. The only way in my opinion to do this right is to rid the entire fishery of the ITQ and have it all back in the hands of the Crown to be allocated to the active commercial fisherman and the rec sector. Thus ridding us of the greedy fish lords that DFO has given all the control to.
 
Would also like to add that some solid data coming from ideas like Fish hunters regarding the value of a stamp and mandatory reporting would go a long way to making sure the correct amount is allocated if this pipe dream of no more ITQ and proper ,fair allocation was ever to be realized.
 
Thanks Jencourt
Deleted my question from other thread so not to hijack.

I assume it is not all being fished or not all being caught.
Where is the poundage for the stupid program that DFO is running for purchasing/ transferring quota, that my tax dollars is paying to run even though it has been made very clear that no one is wants it or supports it?

Those in the know... Was the commercial 85% caught last year or was there quota left over?

Thanks!
Tips
 
The season has not closed for but they are getting near the end of there quota.
There is a link on the dfo site I will try to find....
http://www-ops2.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/contractordata/HALIBUT_activity.pdf



The commercials need a way to transfer quota or you would see commercials dumping dead fish over the side.
It gets real complicated when the fish and get are different species on one set.
What do you do... keep them or let them go and hope they come back to life...
Like they do in other countries....
 
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I understand the need for some way to transfer. That is an after the catch need that only needs a system in place to deal with the actual fish caught.Transferring quota for the purpose of utilizing by-catch is one thing.Having the right to lease it and sell it.(effectively own it) is another all together. One dose not have to come with the other.
 
I understand the need for some way to transfer. That is an after the catch need that only needs a system in place to deal with the actual fish caught.Transferring quota for the purpose of utilizing by-catch is one thing.Having the right to lease it and sell it.(effectively own it) is another all together. One dose not have to come with the other.

well put....
 
Commercial season ends today Nov 7
Total commercial quota was 5,479,553 lbs including the small carryover from last year Current catch is at 5,242,192 lbs so about 237,00 lbs left to go. There is one anticipated off load in the next 24 hours of 6600 estimated pounds. Currently another 9 vessels finishing off then transitting back in the next couple of days
 
I enquired into the "buying quota" 3 phone calls from dfo and some emails later....i have some info on it if anyone wants to read what they sent me...give me a shout....all the questions i asked where never really answered..My biggest question was "If i buy lets say 100lbs and catch a 150lber what do i do?" Apperently fisheries is allowing for overages that u have to report, so i should buy 9lbs(min) and go catch a big one! Average cost to buy is around $5 a pound, and u cant just walk into the tackle shop and buy. U have to find a seller, so in victoria theres 2 longliners(area 19)....the lady on the phone told me that if I can find a local fisherman that will sell his quota, i'll get a better rate on the price per pound, if not i have to go through a website that will have quotas for sale out of vancouver. This experimental fishery is a pile of crap, and I'm not giving any more money to go fishing!
 
no commercial halibut boat can catch any species of fish with out some quota for it all boats are monitored by cameras that cannot be stopped when fishing; any in fractions and boat tied up until all fish are covered by proper quotas; so no illegal fishing; and all is sustainable
 
There's nothing sustainable in commercial fishing in my opinion.

They should also stop all the unemployment insurance fisheries.
 
I enquired into the "buying quota" 3 phone calls from dfo and some emails later....i have some info on it if anyone wants to read what they sent me...give me a shout....all the questions i asked where never really answered..My biggest question was "If i buy lets say 100lbs and catch a 150lber what do i do?" Apperently fisheries is allowing for overages that u have to report, so i should buy 9lbs(min) and go catch a big one! Average cost to buy is around $5 a pound, and u cant just walk into the tackle shop and buy. U have to find a seller, so in victoria theres 2 longliners(area 19)....the lady on the phone told me that if I can find a local fisherman that will sell his quota, i'll get a better rate on the price per pound, if not i have to go through a website that will have quotas for sale out of vancouver. This experimental fishery is a pile of crap, and I'm not giving any more money to go fishing!

And somewhere in the dim recesses of Fisheries and Oceans west coast headquarters a mandarin bureaucrat reads over the e-mail and shrieks “finally” with excitement and joy, then reaches for the memo pad, titles it “Next Steps” and begins to scribble.

- Call Ottawa and tell them we finally have, absolute proof that there is overwhelming, interest and support among sport fishermen for the EXPERIMENTAL HALIBUT QUOTA LEASING PROGRAM and they can blow the dust of the ‘we are making it permanent’ press releases and role them out.

- Call Research, Stats and Analysis and tell them I need some supportive background and talking points for the press release updates; perhaps something like sport fishermen’s enquiries and interest in the program has gone up a 100% in the last week alone. Note; do this first, as we can now move up getting rid of that department to next week. Come to think of it we don’t need the staff on the Halibut Quota Leasing Special Projects Team anymore. My next performance appraisal is going to go great.

- call JP and tell him he owes me that drink.

- call the wife and tell her I get to keep this fraked up job and she can buy the Lexus.
 
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I enquired into "Lease/Rent quota" 3 phone calls from dfo and some emails later....i have some info on it if anyone wants to read what they sent me...give me a shout....all the questions i asked where never really answered..My biggest question was "If i Lease/Rent lets say 100lbs and catch a 150lber what do i do?" Apperently fisheries is allowing for overages that u have to report, so i should Lease/Rent 9lbs(min) and go catch a big one! Average cost to Lease/Rent is around $5 a pound, and u cant just walk into the tackle shop and Lease/Rent. U have to find a seller, so in victoria theres 2 longliners(area 19)....the lady on the phone told me that if I can find a local fisherman that will Lease/Rent his quota, i'll get a better rate on the price per pound, if not i have to go through a website that will have quotas for Lease/Rent out of vancouver. This experimental fishery is a pile of crap, and I'm not giving any more money to go fishing!

Made some corrections to your post........
You should note that it's a one season deal and you would have to go through it every year...
No carry over in that deal ....
GLG

correction there is a 10% carry over.....
so rent 50 lbs for $250 and if you don't catch a fish they will carry over 5 lbs for next year....
 
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Rockfish is 100% correct
In fact they have played with the numbers.
Went to a meeting up in CR and DFO said "lot's of interest on the DFO website".
Here are the numbers....... (can't remember what they were) but the inquires were made up of people telling them to pound sand or to ask real questions..... numbers all lumped together.....
Let's not do that again........
GLG
 
Where can I find the pounds leased this year? Anyone know?
I ripped this from the documents I got today...

In 2011 DFO introduced an experimental halibut recreational fishery to allow individuals or businesses to lease quota from the commercial sector to use or make it available to clients to harvest recreationally. The majority of participants were individuals who intended to use the quota for personal fishing. A small number of businesses also participated. Of the 4,462 pounds of quota leased from the commercial sector by the recreational sector, 220 pounds were harvested, 4,185 were transferred back to the commercial sector and 55 pounds were unused. The 2012 experimental halibut recreational fishery is still open, thus final numbers for 2012 are not yet available.

I'm still steaming after I read these documents.
GLG
 
There's nothing sustainable in commercial fishing in my opinion.

They should also stop all the unemployment insurance fisheries.

Funny you say that. At least they are accountable. Harvesting without proper catch data is far less sustainable ( the way guiding and the rec community as a whole is now).

Lorne
 
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More from the document I got today.

Benefits
Participation in the proposed quota transfer licence program will be voluntary. Benefits are likely positive for participants; however, these benefits were not quantified or monetized.
Businesses which provide recreational fishing services (e.g. guides, lodges, marinas) and that participate in the program, are assumed to receive neutral or positive incremental benefits beyond costs (i.e., profits). A total of 26 experimental fishery licences have been issued to businesses over 2011 and 2012. Of the businesses that participated in the experimental fishery in 2011, approximately 30% also participated in 2012. Since the program is voluntary, repeat participation suggests an anticipation of positive or neutral net benefits through participation; those businesses that anticipate net costs are unlikely to participate a second time. Businesses may use quota to minimize late season cancellations, expand the fishing experience for guests or for other means to maintain or increase profits.
If there is an increase in recreational fishing activity due to the proposed licence, there may be indirect benefits to businesses that support the recreational fishing sector (e.g. accommodations, fuel etc). The scale of these benefits would depend on the location and type of recreational activity that occurs.
Individual Canadian fishers may also voluntarily access additional halibut fishing opportunities under the program, or may do so under the licence of a participating business. Such participants are assumed to receive benefits in the form of enjoyment and fish, at least equal to the costs of participation. These net benefits would be incremental to those achieved under the regular recreational fishery, as the participants have increased access to halibut. A total of 111 experimental fishery licences have been issued to individual fishers in 2011 and 2012. Of the individuals that participated in the experimental fishery in 2011, approximately 23% also participated in 2012.
Direct economic benefits will accrue to participating fishers and businesses. The majority of these benefits are likely to accrue to BC resident fishers. Over the past five years in BC, Canadians purchased approximately 250,000 tidal water licences with about 40% fishing for halibut; BC residents purchased over 80% of the licences. In addition, the majority of participants in the 2011 experimental fishery were individuals who intended to use the licence for personal fishing purposes. 2 The number of businesses that provide recreational fishing services that participated in the experimental licence program is small (<50). The total number of businesses that provide tidal water recreational fishing services in BC is unknown, with many located in rural and remote areas. There may be benefits to Canadians more generally, from improved conservation and management of the halibut fishery.


Canadian consumers of halibut products are not expected to incur a loss in benefits (i.e. consumer surplus) due to a reduced supply of halibut. Most of the halibut caught in Canada is exported so a small reduction in harvest is unlikely to impact the Canadian market. As well, the global seafood market provides numerous substitutes that limit price increases.

so there you have it .... stupid program that by their own document shows that people that bought into it last year are not buying into it this year.... They say repeat client and I say burn me once and I'm not coming back....
We all know who bought into this program, it was friends of slipper skippers.... As my previous post shows from the same document they "expressed interest" for 4462 lbs but used 220 lbs and returned 4185 lbs back to themselves.....
One poor no-mind even left 55 lbs on the table... good thing he can carry over 5.5 lbs this year..... LOL

This document, and the one that goes with it, ranks near the top of the most stupid things I have ever seen come out of government..... It's what happens when you get a bunch of no-minds working together to try to con the people into buying into a program that makes no sense. I'm sure the guy's that started advertizing last year on this website and the local papers for that website where you can purchase (rent) quota must be pushing DFO to continue this stupid idea until they recover their costs.....
Who was that guy that started that rent a halibut website???
Could it be fish4all knows him.....
Seems to me there was a press release with the details..
Perhaps a little bit of public shame is in order...
GLG
 
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