Observations on Supply and Demand - By Bob Hooton

[OldBlackDog]

Observations on Supply and Demand

The reality that the best estimate of the abundance of Skeena steelhead this late summer and fall has dropped to an all-time low is well disseminated by now. Predictably, the causes for the drastic…

steelheadvoices.com

 

[SpringVelocity]

Look out guides and lodges next target.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Look out guides and lodges next target.
View attachment 72236


View attachment 72237

And what about these statements is wrong?
i would think the number is really above 70%.

 

[OldBlackDog]

The reality that the best estimate of the abundance of Skeena steelhead this late summer and fall has dropped to an all-time low is well disseminated by now. Predictably, the causes for the drastic decline are being debated exhaustively. It’s high seas interception. No, it’s competition from cultured pinks and chums from the other side of the Pacific that now dominate the ocean rearing areas. It’s neither; the Southeast Alaska pink and sockeye fisheries out there at Noyes Island is responsible. (That was formally acknowledged as a serious issue in 1993. Granted, the technology has improved but the time and location is unchanged ever since. We witnessed a bad situation becoming worse in 2021 but beware that situation being the sole focus of attention.) Did I mention sea surface temperature and climate change impacts on the marine environments or or land use influences on habitat quantity and quality in the freshwater rearing environments? Domestic commercial fishing, always there in varying degrees, continues to have at least some influence but nowhere near what it once was. How about that in-river Food, Social and Ceremonial fishery that is entirely undocumented? Could it possibly have an impact on steelhead? Alaska has impacts yet to be properly documented and addressed but what about the fisheries conducted by our indigenous fishers right here in our home waters? Why don’t they receive appropriate, independent scrutiny? Ultimately, it’s all of the above but agreement on how much of each, priorities, and next steps will not come easy or early.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Then there’s angling. Is anyone paying attention to that? We now fish Skeena steelhead virtually everywhere from tidewater to headwaters courtesy access created by logging roads, jet boats and rafts, helicopters, quads, snow cats and even hovercraft. Areas that were once safe havens for steelhead that had survived all those extraneous forces and made it home are no longer. The grass beyond the mountains disappeared several steelhead generations ago. How about the gear efficiency and communication options that never existed until relatively recently? Commercial fisheries have been progressively restricted as innovation fueled by competition steadily enhanced their catching power and efficiency. There are only so many boats licensed to fish commercially. The next person that comes along with a shiny new one all tricked out with the latest gear doesn’t get a new license to go fishing wherever and whenever he/she thinks they can derive income from a public resource. Why is it the commercial recreational fishers fail to see the analogies? Why do they believe they should be exempt from application of similar principles as fish supplies diminish? Single barbless hooks, artificial lures only, etc. are hardly a match for no commercial fishing. Foul you say! Lowly recreational fishers are nowhere near the issue all those other factors are. To those of such persuasion I ask, what is it that “we” can influence that might give promise of assisting a now desperate situation for Skeena steelhead?

 

[SpringVelocity]

And what about these statements is wrong?
i would think the number is really above 70%.

Yep finger pointing at its finest.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Yep finger pointing at its finest.

I note in the blog that the finger pointing was at all groups and many other reasons.

So are you implying that guides and lodges should get a free ride on this?

 

[SpringVelocity]

I note in the blog that the finger pointing was at all groups and many other reasons.

So are you implying that guides and lodges should get a free ride on this?

There are two types of people in this world. Those that work together, and put personal differences aside to achieve a common outcome. Then there are those that don't.

Your a don't. Blasting the angling group publicly to create divisions online, and also siding with the very NGO groups that to be honest don't care about our fisheries is tacky.

It creates divisions and infighting. I mean look at the comments on blog I posted totally embarrassing.

Just my view as just rec. angler. If this is your way forward I don't see much hope to be honest. No one will want to be in coalition like that. Sorry just tired of it.

 

[OldBlackDog]

There are two types of people in this world. Those that work together, and put personal differences aside to achieve a common outcome. Then there are those that don't.

Your a don't. Blasting the angling group publicly to create divisions online, and also siding with the very NGO groups that to be honest don't care about our fisheries is tacky.

It creates divisions and infighting. I mean look at the comments on blog I posted totally embarrassing.

Just my view as just rec. angler. If this is your way forward I don't see much hope to be honest. No one will want to be in coalition like that. Sorry just tired of it.

I see nothing in your reply about the fish. You are implying that the angling group have no responsibility?

The angling groups should care about the fish and show some concern for them.

The BCWF and the Steelhead Society to just name a few have and are.

It has been shown that there are angling groups that not really concerned by their actions.

The comments you posted were from regular fishermen who care about fish and fishing.

 

[SpringVelocity]

I see nothing in your reply about the fish. You are implying that the angling group have no responsibility?

The angling groups should care about the fish and show some concern for them.

The BCWF and the Steelhead Society to just name a few have and are.

It has been shown that there are angling groups that not really concerned by their actions.

The comments you posted were from regular fishermen who care about fish and fishing.

Oh here we go anyone that says anything opposite doesn't care about fish now.

I think the two comments I posted are from tidal anglers having a temper tantrum because of the chinook fishing restrictions in SOG. The fact they posted on your page is funny.

Those chinook restrictions backed from the same people you align with. How ironic. But hey continue to divide us should work well for DFO>

Anyway good luck too you.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Oh here we go anyone that says anything opposite doesn't care about fish now.

I think the two comments I posted are from tidal anglers having a temper tantrum because of the chinook fishing restrictions in SOG. The fact they posted on your page is funny.

Those chinook restrictions backed from the same people you align with. How ironic. But hey continue to divide us should work well for DFO>

Anyway good luck too you.

So, you approve of what the guides are doing this year.

 

[SpringVelocity]

Oh look at this one. Slandering our SFAB process publicly awesome. Shameful.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Oh look at this one. Slandering our SFAB process publicly awesome. Shameful.

View attachment 72238

Slandering?

Please advise what is incorrect in this reply?

Further as you are a member of the SFAB is this true about the SFI leading the charge to change the SFAB to more of a guide group?

Something like the fox guarding the chicken pen?

That is why the original SFAB has rules about the % of people who are making a living or part on the backs of fish can sit and vote at the Main Board.

That rule should never change and the Government should be aware of this.

 

[SpringVelocity]

Slandering?

Please advise what is incorrect in this reply?

Further as you are a member of the SFAB is this true about the SFI leading the charge to change the SFAB to more of a guide group?

Something like the fox guarding the chicken pen?

That is why the original SFAB has rules about the % of people who are making a living or part on the backs of fish can sit and vote at the Main Board.

That rule should never change and the Government should be aware of this.

And now were slandering the SFI publicly. Good grief. Your on a roll which group is next tonight?

 

[steeler]

The sport fishing industry and groups have taken pages out of the other resource extraction industry's guide books. Oil and gas has used similar tactics when backed into a corner, First anyone who questions anything they claim is an enemy and only has other interests. Anyone questioning oil and gas is a foreign interferer looking to stop good paying jobs and line their own pockets. Anyone who questions the sport fishing industry is an enemy looking to stop good paying jobs and line their own pockets pretending to care about fish. Everyone and everything else is to blame for fish numbers heading towards extinction except sport fisherman. Don't worry those boats and their "sport fishers" have no impact on those depleted Skeena steelhead, don't worry that pipeline under the Morice will never leak like all the other ones eventually do, don't worry there is a huge supply of old growth timber and those engos are just looking for handouts lying about the state of things. Oh yeah and seals and god damn birds and first nations fisheries and whale watchers but not us. We as glorious sports fisherman can do no harm and are worth trillions to the B.C economy, communities will fail and the economy will fall apart if any changes are brought into the industry. Insert any extractive industry at the end of that sentence and you have the defence of today's industries. Talk and log is a lot like talk and fish and industry will be lobbying to take the very last of each one (for their international clients) without pause to consider what will be left then. Sport fishing may not have caused the worst of the declines but the continued denial of the state of the fisheries to access the dwindling resource is short sighted and will only lead to less sport fishing opportunities in the future.

 

[onefish]

Commercial sport fishing and average joe sportfisherman are very different animals but they get lumped together in the same group for management purposes. That is to the detriment of average joe's IMO.

 

[SpringVelocity]

Wow I had no idea we used a page from resource extraction to run SFAB, and other groups. OMG

 

[Teal]

Commercial sport fishing and average joe sportfisherman are very different animals but they get lumped together in the same group for management purposes. That is to the detriment of average joe's IMO.

I think this is in fact a significant failing when government speaks through the SFAB process. Often the loudest voices in the room tend to be rooted in the commercial sports fishing industry. The SFI does not represent resident anglers rather they represent an industry which absolutely is entitled to a voice, but it needs to be separate from the bc resident recreational angler. On another different note this is why recreational anglers need to be more vocal through their respected reps such as the BCWF, SSBC and others.

 

[Sharphooks]

I think this is in fact a significant failing when government speaks through the SFAB process. Often the loudest voices in the room tend to be rooted in the commercial sports fishing industry. The SFI does not represent resident anglers rather they represent an industry which absolutely is entitled to a voice, but it needs to be separate from the bc resident recreational angler. On another different note this is why recreational anglers need to be more vocal through their respected reps such as the BCWF, SSBC and others.

All is well when there is plenty of resource to go around and everyone gets their fair share. If you substitute “Skeena Lodge Owners” for “SFAB” you can immediately see the downside of what happens when there isn’t enough resource to go around, as was the case in Region VI this past fall with the steelhead resource.

The loudest voice in the room were those that were “vested” .... despite the glaring fact that science had clearly and unambiguously declared the resource an extreme conservation concern, the Provincial managers gave the thumbs up to the “vested” lodges and opened the Skeena system to lodge guides and their paying clients, freely acknowledging that their decision was driven by economics

I found it interesting that in this article about SFAB in the IFM, the author is urging the “average angler” to get involved in the SFAB process rather then shaking his fist at the sky over management decisions he or she doesn’t agree with

The SFAB Process: Why and How Anglers Can Become Engaged - Island Fisherman Magazine

The average recreational fisherman may not realize they have a say in how our fisheries are managed. I’m hoping that you’ve taken interest in the process—an interest in being involved, and not just jumping to conclusions about what was discussed.

islandfishermanmagazine.com

Later in the article, the author uses the term “vested” .....as in....”if you are vested in the sport fishery”....

What does that mean? Are you vested because you own a boat? Are you vested because you love to catch fish? Or are you vested because you are a commercial guide driven by motives of self-advocacy?

It’s a fair question to ask, especially as the resource dwindles and management decisions become based more and more on decibel level.... the loudest lobbyist in the room.

 

[OldBlackDog]

Membership SFAB​

The majority of members of the SFAB will be Primary Level User Group Members.

Primary Level User Group Members are persons who do not receive a significant amount of their annual income directly or indirectly from the recreational fishery. A Primary User Group Member may include a person who is the representative from a non- industry recreational fishing advocacy organization.

The remaining members of the SFAB will be Secondary Level User Group Members.

Secondary Level User Group Members are persons who receive a significant amount of their annual income directly or indirectly from the recreational fishery. A Secondary Level User Group Member may include a person who represents a recreational industry organization.

Membership on the SFAB will be restricted to individuals who are:

• representatives from the North or South Coast Regional Committees;
• representatives from a recognized angling advocacy organization having a provincial membership base;
• representatives from an angling industry or related industry organization having a provincial membership base; or
• persons holding positions on the Pacific Salmon Treaty process, as representatives of the recreational community
• the chairs of the Groundfish/Shellfish and Chinook/Coho Working Groups.

The SFAB will be comprised of the following members:

Representing	Number of seats
North Coast SFAB Regional Committee Chair	1
North Coast SFAB Regional Committee elected reps	7
South Coast SFAB Regional Committee Chair	1
South Coast SFAB Regional Committee elected reps	7
PSC recreational commissioner and panel members	7
Groundfish/Shellfish and Chinook/Coho Working Group chairs	2
BCWF B.C. Wildlife Federation	2
SFI Sport Fishing Institute of B.C.	1
SSOBC Steelhead Society of B.C.	1
BCFFF B.C. Federation of Fly Fishers	1
BCFDF B.C. Federation of Drift Fishers	1
MTA Marine Trades Association	1
BCMA B.C. Marina Operators Association	1
BCLCA B.C. Lodging and Campgrounds Association	1