Looking for used truck buying advice

You know, that's half the reason I have a hard time imagining what I'll eventually replace my old 3rd gen 4runner with.

It has the perfect level of tech: power windows, power door locks, and A/C. I don't really want anything else. This way, it's relatively lightweight, pretty simple to sort out issues, and easy to live with.

I sometimes think about getting a new truck but then I think...holy cow, I'd be paying huge insurance and payments and I'd hate to take it off road anywhere. I paid off the 4runner years and years ago, and it's about a hundred bucks a month to insure it.

It's a good thing they run forever because I'm probably going to be buried in it.
 
what ? how could you possibly drive in traffic without automatic high beams, road sign recognition, lane-departure warning, lane-keeping assist, pre-collision system with pedestrian detection, intersection support, emergency steering assist, adaptive cruise control system with overtake assist, blind-spot monitoring with rear cross-traffic alert, automatic emergency braking systems and 360 cameras.
dont you know its dangerous ? you bad driver, you.
 
what ? how could you possibly drive in traffic without automatic high beams, road sign recognition, lane-departure warning, lane-keeping assist, pre-collision system with pedestrian detection, intersection support, emergency steering assist, adaptive cruise control system with overtake assist, blind-spot monitoring with rear cross-traffic alert, automatic emergency braking systems and 360 cameras.
dont you know its dangerous ? you bad driver, you.

Sad part is so many drivers these days need all that stuff! :rolleyes:
 
Sad part is so many drivers these days need all that stuff! :rolleyes:
Been to far too many funerals that technology would have prevented with those moments that mistakes were made.
 
Considering a slightly newer truck – hoping for some advice on what to look for and what to stay away from

I am seeking some advice because I am not really a truck guy, I have had the same old 1991 GMC 2500 4x4 for a number of years. It really is a nice, dependable truck that served me well for the limited use I had for a truck while living in the city – it was insured for the Summer, hauling the boat and 5th wheel to the island for fishing in June and back home in September. The rest of the year it mostly sat in the carport.

Since leaving the city, I find that things have reversed – the car sits most of the time and the truck is suddenly the daily driver - and for that, the 1991 just is not all that comfortable – they didn’t even bother with headrests back in those days!

I don’t have a huge budget – 25K would be max and would prefer to stay under 20K.

I think I would like another ¾ or a 1 ton. My boat can be towed by anything with 5,000 lb towing capacity, but traveling logging roads with a load of firewood is hard on a truck.

Considering my budget, should I bother or am I better off living with what I have?


Toyota tundra hands down, I have a 2013 I bought new, I have 350k on it and outside of breaks and tires, Ive had to replace the alternator twice, I've flushed the trans every 100k. All the joints and suspension are still fine, its seen plenty of dirt road travel. Its been the most reliable vehicle Ive ever known, tows plenty
 
You know, that's half the reason I have a hard time imagining what I'll eventually replace my old 3rd gen 4runner with.

It has the perfect level of tech: power windows, power door locks, and A/C. I don't really want anything else. This way, it's relatively lightweight, pretty simple to sort out issues, and easy to live with.

I sometimes think about getting a new truck but then I think...holy cow, I'd be paying huge insurance and payments and I'd hate to take it off road anywhere. I paid off the 4runner years and years ago, and it's about a hundred bucks a month to insure it.

It's a good thing they run forever because I'm probably going to be buried in it.
Love my 3rd gen too. Nothing fancy , doesn’t owe me anything . Only down side can’t get a bigger boat lol . Definitely feel the 17ft behind it .
 
what ? how could you possibly drive in traffic without automatic high beams, road sign recognition, lane-departure warning, lane-keeping assist, pre-collision system with pedestrian detection, intersection support, emergency steering assist, adaptive cruise control system with overtake assist, blind-spot monitoring with rear cross-traffic alert, automatic emergency braking systems and 360 cameras.
dont you know its dangerous ? you bad driver, you.
This coming from a guy with a boat with a cockpit with every bell and whistle known to man
 
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I remember when you posted that thread originally.....I was pretty damn impressed how that 4 runner did.....and you were just learning to drive too!
Yeah I'd barely had my license for two decades at that point!

Seriously though it's impressive what that little tank will endure. Truck and boat, actually, fit that description.
 
I think I am getting another Titan or a newer Tundra. From moving over to an import it is little hard to go back.
Tundra is either getting a big makeover soon or it needs to go hybrid. No change to platform since 2007 and the fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks.
 
Tundra is either getting a big makeover soon or it needs to go hybrid. No change to platform since 2007 and the fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks.
I've been saying that since 2011. Until then it's throw away dodges. Buy them used and toss them as soon as the warranty runs out. That's when they self destruct anyways.
 
Tundra is either getting a big makeover soon or it needs to go hybrid. No change to platform since 2007 and the fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks.
thats one of the benefits of toyota, they dont keep trying to make "new and improved", they test the hell out of something then keep it for a long time makeing any fixes as production goes along, they actually have an incentive for their empolyees that pushes this along. the best toyota you can ever buy is the last year before a major change.
 
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Tundra is either getting a big makeover soon or it needs to go hybrid. No change to platform since 2007 and the fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks.

I would rather take bad fuel mileage than crappy reliability. Just my opinion.

I loved my GMC Sierra but it got old with the electrical and front end issues etc.
 
Tundra is either getting a big makeover soon or it needs to go hybrid. No change to platform since 2007 and the fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks.
actually if you look at real owner reported figures on Fuelly you will see all the full sized v8 trucks with similar HP get the same reported average mileage, the tundra is no worse and no better than any other comparably sized truck/engine combo and that’s simply because of the mathematics of it.


to go 100kph you will use X amount of fuel to produce Y amount of energy required to move truck Z, based on the mass, friction, and drag coefficient. same goes for acceleration, which is what makes the difference in city mpg. Regardless of who makes the engines, they all pretty much have the same internal friction coefficients, all of them use very good fuel injection systems and I may be wrong but I’m pretty sure they all have full lock up torque converter in all the autos now. What really makes a difference on fuel economy is how much of the maximum capacity of the engine are you using, as you near the maximum output the fuel economy drops massively as there is less time for the engine to pull in more air and therefore the stoichiometric ratio drops and less of the mix and burns cleanly. Now you can compensate for that by adding a turbo, however you will then increase maintenance costs and shorten engine lifespan. This effect can actually be drastically demonstrated and has been by numerous people

top gear did this years ago, they drove a prius around a race track and a bmw m3 just had to keep up with it. the prius got 17mpg, the m3 got 19mpg

and to contend your statement of "the fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks" we just an FYI the tundra is American, it is built in Texas. And I don’t think anyone will be able to successfully argue American engineering is better than japans engineering, all major manufactures are so close in tolerances now that its like comparing lap times on an Olympic 100 sprint, its down to %.01. What make the vehicles worthwhile in the long run is how long will you own it after paying it off, and how long will it last before the maintenance costs make it uneconomical to run.

fuel economy comes down to drag coefficient, mass and friction that’s the reality of it. I can tell you personally from having friends with dodge/chev/ford, I've owned a ford (f250 5.4L) we all get the same mileage when stock. If you go to the local dealer and buy one of the factory lifted dodges with all the industry fap they sell you, that lifted dodge that is supposed to get the best MPG will absolutely not get the advertised mpg. simply because they usually market the mpg based off a single cab 2wd truck, not a lifted crew cab 4x4.
 
The saying "your mileage may vary" is a common figure of speech these days, but it is true when looking at real world fuel consumption. My work fleet includes 2002 and 2014 chev half tons, both with the same cab/box configuration and 5.3L Vortec 4WD powertrain. We keep logbooks for billing and tax, so we know the fuel use. They all operate in the same area and do the same trips to building sites, lumber yard, landfill etc. The newer truck has cylinder deactivation and a more sophisticated transmission; the difference is tangible: lifetime average of 14.3 L/100km, vs 16.7 L/100 km on the older truck without it. The 98 Ram with 5.7 Hemi is worse again at 18.0.

The 2014 has real time fuel use display so you can see the effect of cylinder deactivation on the freeway, on level straight roads the fuel burn in V4 mode drops to the 11-12 L/100 km range.

I had an F150 Eco Boost with 10 speed transmission as a loaner vehicle for 2 weeks last year and observed it sitting at 10-11 L/100 km on the flats with an average of 13.5 for the period. Not long enough for a real comparison but indicates it would be possibly 10% better than the GM I have now. I suspect a chunk of that comes from the auto engine stop feature which obviously comes into play if you're in towns and cities a lot.

Tundra needs some of these improvements to get back to competitive. A lot of them are relatively "bolt on" and don't require a platform overhaul. And yes, I know it's US assembled (with Japanese design and engineering). My wife drives a Pontiac Vibe which is a badge engineered Toyota assembled in California. It's been perfect, perfect reliability record and zero money spent on repairs, just maintenance and wear items. Not our first Toyota either, I would always consider one. Tundra is one model that's behind the pack at the moment, whereas the RAV Hybrid is crushing sales numbers right now.
 
The saying "your mileage may vary" is a common figure of speech these days, but it is true when looking at real world fuel consumption. My work fleet includes 2002 and 2014 chev half tons, both with the same cab/box configuration and 5.3L Vortec 4WD powertrain. We keep logbooks for billing and tax, so we know the fuel use. They all operate in the same area and do the same trips to building sites, lumber yard, landfill etc. The newer truck has cylinder deactivation and a more sophisticated transmission; the difference is tangible: lifetime average of 14.3 L/100km, vs 16.7 L/100 km on the older truck without it. The 98 Ram with 5.7 Hemi is worse again at 18.0.

The 2014 has real time fuel use display so you can see the effect of cylinder deactivation on the freeway, on level straight roads the fuel burn in V4 mode drops to the 11-12 L/100 km range.

I had an F150 Eco Boost with 10 speed transmission as a loaner vehicle for 2 weeks last year and observed it sitting at 10-11 L/100 km on the flats with an average of 13.5 for the period. Not long enough for a real comparison but indicates it would be possibly 10% better than the GM I have now. I suspect a chunk of that comes from the auto engine stop feature which obviously comes into play if you're in towns and cities a lot.

Tundra needs some of these improvements to get back to competitive. A lot of them are relatively "bolt on" and don't require a platform overhaul. And yes, I know it's US assembled (with Japanese design and engineering). My wife drives a Pontiac Vibe which is a badge engineered Toyota assembled in California. It's been perfect, perfect reliability record and zero money spent on repairs, just maintenance and wear items. Not our first Toyota either, I would always consider one. Tundra is one model that's behind the pack at the moment, whereas the RAV Hybrid is crushing sales numbers right now.

I don’t disagree that there are more advanced engines out there, but they have all had some teething problems and often come at a premium. they also often have issues that should have been figured out in testing before getting handed to customers, that’s where Toyota has the high ground so to speak. They don’t let something out the door that hasn’t been thoroughly tested tried and true, that’s also why they don’t change things as often and have far fewer issues

the Eco boost is a great example of good idea, bad initial execution, there were premature water pump failures, premature turbocharger failures (one of my buddies had his fail on his unmodified daily driver at 6000k), timing chain issues that require the engine to be opened up, lots of other niggly issues like front seat assemblies falling apart. these are things that should not be happening on modern cars, these should be worked out well before releasing it to the consumer.

The real problem though is that by the time the north American auto companies resolve most of the issues (if they bother at all, dodge 2500 and 3500 trucks have had multiple recalls over the years 2013-2017 for the front suspension issues) they move on to a new design have a whole new list of problems with the new design.

I place far more value on having reliability and low long term maintenance cost over getting 1mpg better fuel economy,

There is a website for that shows owner reported numbers here are some links below, filter for engine size and all the trucks are within 1mpg of each other, and toyota is not at the bottom by any means

So to make a broad statement that "fuel mileage is embarrassingly bad compared to the much improved American trucks" just doesn’t ring true if you compare apples to apples. If you want to compare the tundra to the eco-diesel or ecoboost sure, then sure the eco engines get better fuel economy but that’s comparing apples to oranges
 
Well, one way or another, I hope they update the Tundra soon.

Could help drive down the price on a ten year old one, and historically speaking, buying a ten year old Toyota and driving it for another fifteen years is about my speed.
Oh I dont disagree, I would have loved it if they brought out the diesel like had been proposed, if they did that I would be the first to place an order.

But I dont think you will see anything revolutionary coming up with the tundra, since they hold such a small market share in the full sized pickup market (Nissan even smaller), it wouldnt make much fiscal sense. They will likely hold a steady course on producing simple reliable pickups as they always have.
 
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