Line between safe and stupid

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TowingTomics

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I am new here but I notice a common thread on a lot of the topics. There seems to be an unwritten rule that separates those that can safely fish offshore and those that are assumed stupid for even thinking about going out there. The line seems to be drawn around the minimum size boat required to tackle the offshore banks in a relatively safe manner.
I would like to submit both my own opinion on this and ask for feedback from the rest of you.

In my opinion: The size of your boat will not make much of a difference if you are not prepared for the challenges of fishing offshore. While a bigger boat will keep you more comfortable in moderate weather there are few boats in the sport fishing fleet that will withstand any kind of a real blow 30 – 60 knots offshore. If you watch the weather both before you go and while you are out there I don’t see any reason why you shouldn’t be able to fish out there in relative safety. I spent last year fishing almost exclusively 30 – 40 miles off of Bamfield in a 24’ Welcraft and on some of the good days it was flat as a pancake out there, no reason why someone in a well equipped 18’ boat couldn’t have been out there with us. We all know that there is no fishing like offshore fishing, the salmon action is constant and the halibut and other bottom fish are abundant, so why wouldn’t you want to go out and fish there?


So I have two questions. In your opinion what is the minimum equipment requirement for fishing out where we all know limits are just a boat ride away? What is your reasoning behind this number?
 
3 weeks ago I took my 17.5' kencraft to the big bank, first time being out there. No problems. Problay not the smartist thing I've done but I'm back. ohh ya I bought the boat for 440.00 bucks.

Chris
 
Yes fishing was worth it. I got pretty sick I think if we were in a bigger boat might not of got sick ?
I just thought of everything that could have went wrong and made sure I could do somthing about it . I had all the little toys I even took a back up back up engine just incase.
 
TheRock, Thanks for the link. That is a good thread and there are more then a few good opinions in it.

SaltyB, doesn't matter how big your boat is if you are susceptible to sea sickness it can take your whole day and chuck it in the water. Only time I have ever been sea sick was on a 76' packer out of Vancouver about 15 years ago.
 
I go to Swiftsure Bank all the time from Renfrew.My boat is a 17.5 hardtop malibu.It's powered by a 175 Yamaha and 9.9 Honda. I have everything but radar.I take 10 gal of extra gas,we all have floater suits,we listen two the VHF,and keep a close eye on the weather.
I don't think I can be any safer.I think you only go fishing where YOU and YOUR GUESTS are comfortable and safe,if they are not turn back and take them where they are.Be smart.It's the stupid ones at get in trouble.
 
quote:Originally posted by TheRock

There was a great thread a while back on this exact same topic! The tread title is "Halibut West Coast" do a title search for it in the search tab. Excellent thread great posts, worth the read. Here is the direct link to it..
http://www.sportfishingbc.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3680&whichpage=2&SearchTerms=off,shore,safety
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I'm going to cut and paste my post here...I'm tired of fishing dead bodies out of the water, and I've fished 2.



What makes a seaworthy boat is a very subjective thing.

Seaworthy is a relative term dependent on water conditions. You should have plenty of power to get up on step and plane quickly...you should have WEIGHT to your boat, beam is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT as well as deadrise, stability, freeboard etc.. Length is one component of that, in my opinion, you should have a sealed hull like a Whaler or Grady capable of self bailing/draining while under power. Fishing the banks 20 miles out? 22 footer minimum with self bailing cockpit...or be prepared for a very long ride back if you make the mistake of staying too long. Seaworthy is dependent on the safety of the vessel as well..twin engines or single? How fast does it move on auxiliary? How reliable is your power and boat systems? Do you have an ERPB? Do you have survival suits? Do you have radar or gps? Did you file an sailing plan? How much fuel does your boat have? How much fuel does your boat consume? All factors which are important. How fast your boat handle 5 foot seas 10 foot seas, 35 foot swells with seas?? What kinda interval between the waves? Some boats can handle having the crap pounded and slammed out of them on a hell run back to shore..others can't.

One of the other things is knowing how to drive your boat as well, to get the heck out of the rough stuff and through it to get back to shore faster. Some boats can move at 20 knots through slop water. Other boats, 10 knots. A BIG difference when time if of the essence.

All boats are not created equal..there are reasons why Boston Whalers cost money. There are reasons why Grady Whites cost money..and we're not talking "names" either.

There's a difference between "big" water and "dangerous" water as well.

At any rate, if you're inexperienced and stupid enough not to recognize when the weather is coming up and intensifying, then you're a fool to begin with. Usually one bad experience is all you should need to smarten you up if you're ignorant and arrogant, if you're lucky enough to survive, and if you make the same mistake again, you're really deserving---not that you weren't the first time.


Know your boat, know it's limitations. Know yourself, know your limitations. Boat and live within those limitations. Just cuz somebody else is there fishing, and seems unconcerned, means diddley..there's different limits for everyone. For example, a 30 foot Grady White with 500 horses off the back may be out there fishing comfortably, and have no problem flying back in on big water. Whereas a guy in a 21 foot Fishin' Machine with 200 hours would be begging for mercy....different situations entirely.

I can recall it blowing NW 25 knots off Langara, which makes for some big water, fishing off Langara Island on the Northwest Side for Springs. We were bottom fishing cuz the fishing was slow, and the boat I was in was very capable of handling the swells. Big boat, Big HP hanging off the back. We boated a 60 lb hali, I hog tied 'em and recommended it was time to head in. Not so fun when you have to think about what you're doing. The guests were comfortable so I put down some cut plugs off the downriggers, I could tell the weather was rising... and we spent about a half hour trolling in. We hooked a couple of 25 lbers, and then I suggested the "warm up" pit stop at the lodge and then a quiet evening fishing the tide at a favorite spot on the east side of island, calm, warm etc.. We hopped up on plane, and rode the 15 footers into the pass and back to the Lodge feeling very comfortable whereas everyone else (smaller boats) was to stay OFF the west side.

However, you really have to ask yourself. How much fun are you really going to have anyways putting yourself in that position? what kinda benefit are you really gaining? (none)

Answering questions like this REALLY should put it into perspective for you, and if you're putting in yourself into dangerous positions, you don't respect the sea, and it'll take your life. If you lost it because of that, hate to say it you deserve your predicament and fate. By the way, radios won't save you from sinking. The average response time for a helicopter, boat or search and rescue crew is far above what most people think, if you manage to get a mayday call through and they hear you.

By the way, if I think the weather is coming up you should be leaving WELL in advance, I'll stop and tell people on other boats I said so, and take them with me, or ask 'em if they're coming if not, I'll point that out. Oftentimes the suggestion is enough to wake 'em up.

By the way, you should NEVER be fishing out there in rising weather without a "buddy" boat. if they leave, you leave, if you leave, they leave. And you all leave together. That simple.
 
Anyone who goes to Swiftsure in a boat under 18’ has guts. All the best judgment and seamanship won’t balance the risk if the weather or tidal chop rears its ugly head. Swiftsure bank is a world unto it’s self once there, the route to get to it and back is were the danger is. Large ocean swells with 4’ chop on top are more than small boats can deal with. The action of these swells over shallow water (150’) make them very steep. This can roll a small boat, no room for error. Not all days are like that, just 8 out of 10.

That’s just my opinion.
 
Very informative,advice FM. Something of a reminder now and again as it sinks in.
I think I respect the sea,but the reading you provided adds to it.
 
I am enjoying this thread. Fishin Magician, I'd be interested to hear your opinion on fishing 3-6 miles outside of Bamfield in an 11' foot Whaler with a newish Honda 15 (no back-up power of course), compass, sounder and gps. Only me in the boat if I go out there.
 
quote:I'd be interested to hear your opinion on fishing 3-6 miles outside of Bamfield in an 11' foot Whaler
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Are you talking about inside Barkley sound or outside the surf line in open water? There is a big difference. I wouldn't go outside the surfline in the rig you describe.
T2
 
I go with my Malibu 182 and never have problems. That's because I am very aware of what the weather is doing and always play on the safe side of the weather reports. It's easy to stay out there longer than you should when it is still calm out there and the fish are biting even when they call for wind in the forcast. I always heed the forcast more when I fish offshore than when inshore.
 
We've been out about 8 miles off Cape Beale in my buddies 17' Whaler. However, that was one of the rare August mill pond days where there wasn't a breath of wind or a cloud in sky and there were lots of other boats around.

Perhaps I'm a big chicken, but I don't think I'd want to be spending much time offshore without radar, redundant main engines, gas tanks, batteries, VHF, and GPS.

I wouldn't want to have to limp back in on a 9.9 kicker in 10 foot swell that just blew up. It's amazing how fast the sea conditions can change out there.
 
quote:Originally posted by Yote

I go with my Malibu 182 and never have problems. That's because I am very aware of what the weather is doing and always play on the safe side of the weather reports. It's easy to stay out there longer than you should when it is still calm out there and the fish are biting even when they call for wind in the forcast. I always heed the forcast more when I fish offshore than when inshore.
Click to expand...
 
quote:Originally posted by fishin_magician

quote:Originally posted by Yote

I go with my Malibu 182 and never have problems. That's because I am very aware of what the weather is doing and always play on the safe side of the weather reports. It's easy to stay out there longer than you should when it is still calm out there and the fish are biting even when they call for wind in the forcast. I always heed the forcast more when I fish offshore than when inshore.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Hmm...just cuz you've "never" had problems doesn't mean diddley. All it means is that you've been lucky enough to not have broken down or a series of other things to happen over the course of a few minutes or hours. All it means is that you've been lucky enough that the forecasts have been correct. All it means is...one of these days if you do it with any regularity...something will happen. Usually when people die in boating accidents, its not just one thing that kills 'em..maybe in the autopsy report it says "drowning" or "hypothermia", however, engine failure coupled with "no sailing plan", no safety equipment, idiot captain, and poor decision making, and mechanical failure can all snowball in a hurry.

Just cuz you never have had problems, doesn't mean you "never will" have problems. However, despite what you may think, this a very real possibility.
 
quote:Originally posted by tubber

I am enjoying this thread. Fishin Magician, I'd be interested to hear your opinion on fishing 3-6 miles outside of Bamfield in an 11' foot Whaler with a newish Honda 15 (no back-up power of course), compass, sounder and gps. Only me in the boat if I go out there.
Click to expand...

Hmmm..if you're in a survival suit, with flares, a sailing plan, a radio, and you're all alone not jeopardizing anyone else's life except your own, on a flat calm day, you're playing the odds, and you'll probably live to see a few days and do a few hundred trips if you pick your days. However, an 11 foot whaler won't do you diddley if a 10 footer comes right into it, and you're passed out from a medical problem. It's not like the S & R are going to be able to see you anyways...unless they're in a helicopter almost right above you.

At any rate, you're bordering on insane in my opinion. Whaler or no whaler. Just cuz you get away with it a few days...doesn't mean you're always going to get away with it.
 
I am mostly with FM with one exception, even alone you are risking others (coasties for starters) lives....keep the small Whaler in safer water, much.

Nothing gainst Whalers, I ran a 17' for years - safely and w due caution and always a buddy boat.

JD
 
Mr Magician. There are no guarantees no matter what you are in out there. There can always be a worst case scenario like what you pointed out. I prepare for the trip and have all the safety equipment that I need to make it a safe trip IN MY OPINION.

Now that's not saying that something can't happen out there because sometimes **** happens. It's like bow hunting in grizzly country. Yes it can be dangerous but I appreciate the other positive aspects that I get from doing that. I don't plan on putting my bow down anytime soon. I also don't plan on not going to the banks with my boat anytime soon either.
 
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