IPHC Halibut recomendations for 2009

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so question is LC as one of the Renfrew regulars, if they slapped this on you, do you then redirect focus in Renfrew? No longer offer the hali/salmon package and just focus on the beach at 60% the daily rate or something along that lines? Seems to me that is what many would do as it is really hard to justify going all the way out to the banks just to pick up that 10-15 pound flattie (besides when you can dial in the coho/springs as well).

This would be fine to focus on the beach, but I would then be worried about the newly introduced salmon fishing pressure and the much larger #'s of big springs that will be taken because of this first light boat concentration...thus impacting the Sooke fishery much more than typical when Renfrew fishing would focus on the banks (I think that makes sense, but I'll clarify if need be!).

I think micro-managing needs to be done for the benefit of all. Banks fishing Swiftsure to La Peruse etc - limit 2 - annual (doesn't need to be 10 - personally I think 7-8 is fine even if Renfrew locals end up on the short end there because of chicken size), Sooke/Hardy fishing, limit 1, same annual - a charter can still get the business with 1/person down here because of the larger size and the simple fact that 2/person isn't exactly an easy task anyway. I don't think that is unreasonable.

Thoughts?
 
I can reply
Halibut is managed coastwide and not area specific...
For this reason alone it is not fair to limit certain areas to more daily limits than other's.
Secondly, a 1 a day limit is a real problem for most who only charter or advertise single day charters...
Lodges such as the one's up North would not see much of a decline as long as the possesion limit stay's the same but down south...look out.... alot of those boy's do single day charters and it would most definately impact them.
Thirdly, just because an area like Hardy has what you seem to think...larger fish so they should only be allowed to keep 1 less a day than other areas is crazy.
So what your saying is the guy's who chose to fish in those area's and release the breeders are going to get punished for it...
that's not going to work at all.
We are all missing the bigger picture anyway's.
The government needs to simply take away some of the free allowcation they gave the commercial guy's years ago and allocate it back to the general public...simple and true.
The commercial sector hasn't caught their allowable catch in the last 2 years from what I understand so it wouldn't exactly seem like like they are losing it anyway's.
I for one will be looking forward to seeing the lawsuits that will be coming if DFO doesn't get a handle on the situation fast...

www.coastwidesportsfishing.com
 
well, of course I have no issue with 2/day everywhere with that same annual limit if everyone is panicked about fair or not, but I'm just talking about where you can justify it verses where you can't. It IS easier to justify 1/day in Sooke vs 1/day in Renfrew...plain and simple - all comes down to what is available in the area. I really don't think guides in Sooke would cry foul IF this were even possible as they know themselves that 1 halibut in Sooke is much more poundage than 2 in Renfrew 9 times out of 10 anyway. I suppose you are taking exception as I mentioned Hardy as well - I don't know the fishery up there well enough, but I do know the average size is bigger than west coast average.

You say halibut managed coastwide/not area specific - is that a 'different' setup than salmon management? There is micro-management for salmon all over the coast, so why not hali?

Yes, obviously the key is the commercial %...but obviously we have to assess the situation as well in the case that politics talk too much there and that % doesn't budge. So, review alternatives with what is left...that's all this is.
 
Richmake ill comment on what you said as for my clients last year I lost only one person to the limit the others had no problem with just the one a day either do I as ill speak for down here as this is where I fish mostly the size is way bigger then the normal ping pong paddles you get from renny (usually)if we are all on the same playing field and we can only fish for 1 a day for everyone well so be it its either just 1 fish or you dont fish at all if people dont want to do it thats THEIR CHOICE and they dont get halibut for there freezer what else can we do?????

I have had clients go with me and after they got 2 in the 40 and 50 lb range say thats more meat than what we got last year and we didnt have to spend $$$$$ and get beat up it is all what the client wants dont get me wrong I love renny its where I started almost 20 years ago when a busy day was 10 boats on a weekend and we never went past the rock pile (didnt need to)and we cut plugged herring.

good points by all now we have to wait and see what the IHC says!!!

This is all political and big brother is watching!!!!!


Wolf

Blue Wolf Charters
www.bluewolfcharters.com
 
Richmake- You need to realize the Goverment IS NOT going to TAKE AWAY any quota from the commercial sector. The best you can hope for is some aggreement is made for the GOV to fund a purchase of more quota. The fact that the commercial sector hasn't caught there quota in the last 2 years only means they chose not to ,as they can carry over 10% till next year. They do this cause they can for finacial or political reasons.

Wolf- Jimmy Pattison is BC packers and they own very little of the overall quota. MOstly owned by private hard working individuals that either had Quota given to them in the IVQ system in the early 90's or purchased it for a large investment. The problem is the leasing that has driven the price of quota through the roof. Which is now going to cost the sports sector HUGE money to purchase and drive the price of quota up even farther.

"Who would have ever thought it would be this much fun catching them one at a time"
 
quote:Originally posted by Deewar25

so question is LC as one of the Renfrew regulars, if they slapped this on you, do you then redirect focus in Renfrew? No longer offer the hali/salmon package and just focus on the beach at 60% the daily rate or something along that lines? Seems to me that is what many would do as it is really hard to justify going all the way out to the banks just to pick up that 10-15 pound flattie (besides when you can dial in the coho/springs as well).

This would be fine to focus on the beach, but I would then be worried about the newly introduced salmon fishing pressure and the much larger #'s of big springs that will be taken because of this first light boat concentration...thus impacting the Sooke fishery much more than typical when Renfrew fishing would focus on the banks (I think that makes sense, but I'll clarify if need be!).

I think micro-managing needs to be done for the benefit of all. Banks fishing Swiftsure to La Peruse etc - limit 2 - annual (doesn't need to be 10 - personally I think 7-8 is fine even if Renfrew locals end up on the short end there because of chicken size), Sooke/Hardy fishing, limit 1, same annual - a charter can still get the business with 1/person down here because of the larger size and the simple fact that 2/person isn't exactly an easy task anyway. I don't think that is unreasonable.

Thoughts?

I think it (1 per day) would have a moderating effect, it would mean that many of the anglers who know how to fish hali inshore would do so, as in shore the size is much larger. It is a little trickier, an involves a little more finess to anchor up for Halibut inshore, but it produces bigger fish, you burn LESS fuel, don't beat the heck out of yourself, and don't go as far. I'll probably be sticking it out off the Waterfront untill the JDF for 2009, fishing for Hali's was a little better of Vic then in Renny anyway untill July.

By making a minor restriction to that fishery, you slow things down on the groundfish considerably. It's like making a river fly fishing only, rather then chucking a worm at trout, an anlger needs to master the art of something a little trickier, and it works quite well in fresh water as a moderator. If someone realises they would need a little more then a bag of whatever Berkley crap Outfitters is pushing and the directions to the hali spot of the day, some people may think twice about exploiting what is a very simple meat fishery. I don't see ANY sport angle in winching up a boatload of 5 pound halibut from 400 feet of water, why destroy 10 fish when 2 or 3 larger would be more productive, and a little easier on the ecosystem. Seems that there would be more to running a guide service then drifting around the edge of Swiftsure, peole would have to learn how to fish. And those that do, I assure you, would be well rewarded

The bulk of my guests would rather have a pair of 40's then a boatload of paddles, that would be easy enough to do on a good tide change out there, then the call is made, either go offshore, or chase springs on the shore, or a little of both. The attitude out there of making sure your box is as full as the next boat coming in is very strong in Renfrew, ESEPECIALLY amongst the guides.

As for Salmon, many more boats come in skunked along the shoreline then do with fish, so I don't think the effort would shift nor have a signifigant impact on salmon. This year, with the exception of the Wedge in a few weeks in July, you would have done about the same fishing Otter/Beechy as you would have fishing Camper/Logan.

Last Chance Fishing Adventures

www.lastchancefishingadventures.com
www.swiftsurebank.com
 
I have seen a significant amount more presure and crowds on the Sooke/Vic hali grounds already, in the past few years it has almost doubled, especially on weekends. That is a given and will only worsen with people avoiding renfrews drive and run to the Bank. I know i won't be going to Swiftsure any time soon, or Big Bank, not for one lil wee hali a head and i am sure many of the renny guides will just fish victoria until mid June. There is lots of swearing and yelling now at conny/race/Border with the increasing crowds too. Even leaving in the dark it's like christamas, with red and green lights buzzing all over. The charters on the South Island will inevitably suffer the ill effects and become even more competitive.

www.tailspincharters.com
 
Bog i know that its just ol jimmy has clout as he is in the political view and has motivation regarding what he does, can you imagine him at a party with a politican and him asking it sure would be nice to have this and this.

Its been going on forever it called ill wash your back if you wash mine.or better yet "political backing"

Rich was only making a statement thats all its all good!!!!

It just saddens me to see what is going to happen as we can debate on here all we want but it is well beyond us here as the decision is probablly already made we are going to get screwed big time I just have a very very very bad feeling about all of this thats all.


Wolf

Blue Wolf Charters
www.bluewolfcharters.com
 
Unfortunattly jackel we will never get more quota but put it on your santa wish list for all of us!!!!!! this is all political and has nothing to do with conservation at all its is the big companies wanting more more more why do you think the price of halibut was up to almost 20 bucks a lb last year?????? because in the past it was lower so not alot of guys went out ,it all has to do with supply and demand which in turn the bigger you are the better because you can get a bunch of leases and fish.

I say say DFO run the country and call it

"DEMOCRACY FOR OTHERS".........to rape and pillage!!!!!!


Wolf

Blue Wolf Charters
www.bluewolfcharters.com
 
Unfortunattly jackel we will never get more quota but put it on your santa wish list for all of us!!!!!! this is all political and has nothing to do with conservation at all its is the big companies wanting more more more why do you think the price of halibut was up to almost 20 bucks a lb last year?????? because in the past it was lower so not alot of guys went out ,it all has to do with supply and demand which in turn the bigger you are the better because you can get a bunch of leases and fish.

I say say DFO run the country and call it

"DEMOCRACY FOR OTHERS".........to rape and pillage!!!!!!


Wolf

Blue Wolf Charters
www.bluewolfcharters.com
 
Why is the guys who contribute the most to the economy (sporties) and take the least amount of fish get the raw end of the deal? Wolf your take on Jimmy is bang on. I can see a day when we will be fishing for halibut through a virtual simulator as there won't be any real ones left.
There are companies farming halibut in PEI, Nova Scotia and Norway right now in land based tanks, hopefully this will take the pressure off the wild stocks soon.
 
Why is the guys who contribute the most to the economy (sporties) and take the least amount of fish get the raw end of the deal? Wolf your take on Jimmy is bang on. I can see a day when we will be fishing for halibut through a virtual simulator as there won't be any real ones left.
There are companies farming halibut in PEI, Nova Scotia and Norway right now in land based tanks, hopefully this will take the pressure off the wild stocks soon.
 
Careful what you wish for. It really concerns me to hear some folks say that 1 hali is good, because its no problem we can hit the big ones close to shore and it only takes one really big one to make the client happy. Haven't we progressed beyond the buffalo hunter?

Isn't this simply a dangerous targeting of the larger spawning females? Shouldn't we be avoiding taking larger halis and instead concentrating effort on the smaller chickens so there is a successful spawn? Anyone can boast about the big ones they haul in and lift up with a fork lift - but that is not the thinking it will take to shift the industry to sustainable conservation........If we adopt this target the big one's near shore mentality it will not be long before there are no fish.

Sorry to be ranting on this topic, but regardless of the fish allocation politics with DFO we as sport fishers should rise above buffalo hunting the large halis that are the future. My vote here is stay away from the large fish and concentrate on the smaller ones. If we have a beef with DFO its really about the allocation decisions they are making....but lets at least stay true to the conservation ethic and avoid hunting down the last big spawner.
 
Careful what you wish for. It really concerns me to hear some folks say that 1 hali is good, because its no problem we can hit the big ones close to shore and it only takes one really big one to make the client happy. Haven't we progressed beyond the buffalo hunter?

Isn't this simply a dangerous targeting of the larger spawning females? Shouldn't we be avoiding taking larger halis and instead concentrating effort on the smaller chickens so there is a successful spawn? Anyone can boast about the big ones they haul in and lift up with a fork lift - but that is not the thinking it will take to shift the industry to sustainable conservation........If we adopt this target the big one's near shore mentality it will not be long before there are no fish.

Sorry to be ranting on this topic, but regardless of the fish allocation politics with DFO we as sport fishers should rise above buffalo hunting the large halis that are the future. My vote here is stay away from the large fish and concentrate on the smaller ones. If we have a beef with DFO its really about the allocation decisions they are making....but lets at least stay true to the conservation ethic and avoid hunting down the last big spawner.
 
Migawd Searun-- we are limited to 12% for the TAC!!!!!! As you pointed out this is NOT a conservation issue.. how many time does this have to be repeated on this thread??. If you can convince me that the resource is in danger, I will be the first to start cutting large ones loose. But remember too, that its not all about guides and thier clients and a lot of rec boats dont have the ability to run to a offshore chicken patch. So do you suggest they get chased off the water?
Staying true to the conservation ethic by letting the big ones go???? Its strickly a matter of choice.. not conservation. And as someone who may make only 3 trips a year for halibut, I can tell you it wont be for 3 ping-pong paddles




20ft Alumaweld Intruder
 
Disappointing response.....we can't keep targeting spawning mature halibut and ensure abundant stocks for the future. Eventually there will be nothing left. Certainly I agree that our principle issue is with the allocation strategy as the number one concern......but, following that, I do believe sports fisherman must</u> take a look in the mirror on the fish we target. Buffalo hunting isn't sustainable. We have the ability to selectively fish, and if we don't we are no different than the commercial guys everyone so happily vilifies. And, by the way this is also a conservation issue....in case you haven't noticed the halibut biomass is.......DOWN. So the whole reason we are talking about reduced allocation is the numbers and size of the biomass is down and the idea is to protect those large spawning halibut.
 
Send me your e-mail link and I will forward you a presentation the Commission did. The female spawning biomass in 2006 was just over 400 million pounds, and dropped to a low of 300 million pound in 2006 and is slowly rebuilding. Projections are for a good recovery if we are able to stay the course until 2010. There is a ton of evidence to support conservation concern...100 million tonnes of good reasons.
 
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