black box

Hey Roy tell that to gibby,kennedy,or in the past weeks and kenyan wells they are and were all very anal about the waythere boat is tuned and those 4 names alone have one many many of the big derbies over and over again i have fished with all of them and i can tell you all there bait is different they don't have some secret roll that only catches 40 pounders.
I agree anyboat on any day can catch lots of fish but i've seen it enough that it matters to me.imho
 
YES but experience and convidence also is huge do you not agree!!!!! and those guys reak of that including yourself and me !!!!LOL LOL

especially gibby LOL LOL

Wolf
 
somebody needs to invent a blackbox type device to counteract the bad fishing mojo that seems to eminate from certain people (I'm sure you all know one). I don't get skunked very often...but if a certain friend of mine is on board I get skunked every</u> time. We call him Fish Repellant.
He's not allowed to touch the gear, so its not bad oils in his skin.
He's never caught a salmon... the one time I managed to get him into a beauty spring...a seal took it at the net.
 
Ah, springtime...the trees blossoming, the fish returning, and the annual black box debate. ;)

I have mixed opinions about black boxes. It seems pretty hokey, that the voltage of a flashlight bulb will make any difference to gear wildly spinning 50-100 feet deep, passing by at 2 knots or more. However, I can't entirely rule out the possibility it is a contributing factor. Just as I don't bring bananas on my boat and each sunrise shake ju-ju beads over the downrigger...anything that has a remote chance of helping catch a fish I'm willing to try.

I am an overly analytic and hyper rational person and I'd like fishing to be a science...isolate the variables that matter, control for the rest, voila, success. But I am starting to realize that what is fun about fishing is the uncertainty -- way too many variables to control and a degree of randomness thrown in. Best you can do is be vigilant about doing the best you can do, and then spend as much time on the water as possible. I think that's what separates the slayers from the try-hards, knowing which factors are key, attention to the details, never cutting corners, and knowing when to switch things up. Plus a huge amount of water time.

Black box is one more factor among MANY MANY others. I put it in the category of maybe it helps, but it can't hurt. I can say with certainty though that if you suck at fishing without one, adding one isn't going to help much! [:o)]

[Backatit: you should tell your friend he should work for greenpeace, think of how many sea creatures he has singlehandedly saved?]

[Black box studies: there's some scientists on this forum who can speak with more authority than me about scientific method, but I don't think we'll ever get a definitive answer on black boxes really working or not. There's too many variables that can't be controlled for in the ocean. I think you'd need a closed environment, a big pool with fish in it, then use the same gear with black box and without, and see difference. On the ocean, maybe a reasonable approximation would be to take someone who is a regular fisher and does well. They turn black box on every half hour and then off for next half hour. Keep stats on when there are bites, fish like this for a month or so in peak season, then see if there's any substantial difference. A good thesis for someone maybe...but otherwise not likely to happen, the only people with a stake in it are manufacturers. They lose everything if prove it does not work. So, is the lack of definitive studies by Scotty or ProTroll a sign? Surely they would publicize a study if it showed definitively their product works? Scotty is now producing and selling nylon cable, eliminating need for their own black box product...is that a sign of what they really think? Enquiring minds want to know!]


PS...the partially controllable randomness that makes fishing fun...this is the same thing that makes gambling fun! (why many anglers are basically gambling addicts IMO) It is luck of the draw in the end, but those who use systems to up their chances of winning will consistently win more than those who don't. Black box is one more system.
 
Another thing to add to the mix from my commercial days...less ganyon between the wire and ball more voltage, more ganyon, less voltage. Same applies for you guys who run the scotty snubbers with big ugly stainless snaps, more dissimiliar metal more heat at the ball. I shorten my ganyon as the season moves on to add more voltage at the ball as i use the 200 Powerpro with some extra bronze & stainless in specific spots for voltage, therfore no B Box. The Sooke Springs seem to like more zap on Pink years and late season.

JDR, add three feet of Ganyon on one side, tie it to your ball and snap it on. See what happens:D



www.tailspincharters.com
 
Tailspin: a dumb question...what do you mean by ganyon? Is that a loop of line or something between end of wire and attached to ball? What material?

And a general comment...fishing seems easy when it is just clip some bait onto a downrigger send it down, wait for the bite. But this shows that there's a whole 'nother level going on that isn't apparent...and that's the expertise you're paying for on a charter. All the little things you don't even know are happening, in your favour.

A charter friend of mine is focused on the charge on the downrigger balls themselves, regardless of black box. One side consistently getting hits, other not...change ball to a new one, and back to normal. Maybe it is corrosion on the metal, or maybe magnetized, or ???. But when you fish 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, you see patterns develop, and hard to argue with success. [any comment on that from commercial fishing experience?]

Speaking from the average joe's camp...this all makes my head spin!
Not exactly "Take worm from can. But on hook. Drop in water. Wait."


And another PS: I figure if you use nylon line; scotty plastic snap 10 feet up from ball; lure 30 feet back from line; that pretty much eliminates any effect of electricity benefits or detriments. So...better to be neutral but eliminate any potential benefits? Or better to chase the positive benefits, but at risk of not getting it right and causing detriments?
 
Ganyon, not sure of the spelling or any of my spelling for that matter;), nylon cord usually white or green used to be sized on number, now it is in test i think, has some good shock stretch.
On the troller my Dad used to rigg extra bronze crimps on the ganyon between the ball(s) and the cable to control the desired amount of voltage at the ball or in the general area, not just focussing on the cable. The same priciple applies to short or long ganyon snubber to isolate voltage.
Many commercial trollers dont run voltage regulators like a black box. They control the natural boat voltage, check for voltage leaks and then adjust as necessary at the ball by small adjustment eg Ganyon lenght, extra bronze crimps etc. The guy at the pointy end of the boat does not always know what is going on on the back deck for experiments[:p]

I guess achieving an aquired voltage at the ball, based on experiments and or experience applies for us as sporties to. What works for one may not work for another fisherman, many factors apply, like wether you clip a release clip to snubber or to the wire, or off the ball.. . I see guys running a black box with a blue scotty snubber, lol... The ball is where your heat is... Ever wonder why the flat pancake weights with the stainless fin fish well or not depending on you rigging configuration, lead, stainless and salt water is a battery and creates electroylosis. Confused Yet? If we were stacking multiple lines up from the ball you would be better vested for a black box.

All this said, i would say keep it simple, experience with one side, find what works for your boat, fishing style, area fished etc etc. Then switch up accordingly.

www.tailspincharters.com
 
Tailspin,, great post, lots to think about, never thought about those blue rubber shock cords and a black box. Don't have a box myself, but would like to have one. Tight Lines,..........BB
 
Ive actually stopped replying to these posts about black boxes, but I feel the need to yet again interject. Black boxes are nothing more than a myth, period. Go spend your money on some good bait, some gas and some time dialing it in. I guarantee your black box will not catch you more fish!

nootkalasttrip015.jpg
 
OK Ok I get it, maybe it was just a poor year last year and not out enough. the zincs on the outboard don't show were so I guess I'm good to go. going out Sun and give it my all. Look out fish here I come. Thanks guys for all your input:D:D going to hit possesion secartary and the trap, let you know how it went.
 
Well i guess you dont want any more of my finned weights then justin LOL LOL and i better stop stacking lines LOL

Well ill admit to doing a dirty trick to a buddy of mine about 4 years ago when fishing Aug for big springs he swears by his black box its a homemede one form his dads commercial days if it wasnt at a certain number he blamed it on that,
So one week I disconnected it(as he is moored right beside me) he would go out and slay fish come back and brag how great fishing was we did this for a whole week every day hed get his limit I would just snicker till I couldnt anymore so I told him he was a bit pissed but now it isnt even turned on anymore.

Alot of it has to do with confidence and know your boat whare your fishing and experience if you think it is giving you an advantage then go for it every bit counts.

I wonder though if you have the box at .60 and there is a different current which has more fresh/dirty/oily/warmer/salinatity/creel/algea/ water you get my drift is it going to change every aspect to it??? I BET YOU THE FARM it will??????


Wolf
 
Unless you are towing an old rust stove...or your boat is blowing out wrong natural voltage, don't worry about the electricity!

"RIGHT PLACE AT THE RIGHT TIME...DOING THE RIGHT THING." = FISH!

Trev and Wolf both do this all day long. Thanks for the dialog guys.

I am down the middle on this one myself!
 
Good trick Wolf.
You are a devious son-of-a-gun.

Don't bother with a black box myself, but I think this year I will check the voltage on my cables. Pro-troll has a good description of 'how-to': http://www.protroll.com/books/?id=5&p_id=4

If nothing else, I'll know that the voltage on the cables is within tolerances, and I don't have some strange electrical aura eminating from my boat.
 
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