Trans Mountain pipeline work destroyed salmon habitat

[islandboy]

"work destroyed salmon habitat"
"not an isolated incident"

 

[Derby]

Subject: Vancouver Sun: Trans Mountain pipeline work destroyed salmon habitat, scientist says


http://vancouversun.com/news/local-...-work-destroyed-salmon-habitat-scientist-says

 

[Dave]

Unfortunately, the creek in question has very little salmon habitat and very few spawners (coho, a few chum) , due to previous urban encroachment and poor agricultural procedures. Saying the pipeline is a cause of salmonid declines, here at least, is a stretch.

 

[ReelSlim]

Unfortunately, the creek in question has very little salmon habitat and very few spawners (coho, a few chum) , due to previous urban encroachment and poor agricultural procedures. Saying the pipeline is a cause of salmonid declines, here at least, is a stretch.

Agreed.......It is the Vancouver Sun after all...lol It was also only a crossing not the entire creek. It will be repaired and they will have to blame something else.

 

[OldBlackDog]

However, the point being made about those terrible people raping the river and killing salmon that the Killer Whales need to survive is front and centre.

The vast majority of people will remember that and nothing else.

This is exactly what the writers for the Green groups do all day.

 

[Powerset]

I certainly recognize the pipeline problems, the environmental problems and the impact on salmon and salmon habitat. I think we may be missing an opportunity here? It seems the Energy Companies and obviously now the Federal Gov’t have a huge stake in the pipeline to make it work. Could we or should we have leveraged that need against our need for salmon enhancement and habitat reconstruction or improvements? I think many of us believe this pipeline going ahead is inevitable, the argument has been made that it’s for the greater good whether you believe it is or not? what I’m saying is there may be an opportunity here for coastal communities specific fisheries specific areas that need big investment dollars, those dollars have to come from somewhere beyond what we’re getting from the federal government already . I’m sure this is not a new concept certainly not a new idea the problem we’ve always run into in the sport fishing industry is who is advocating on our behalf when it comes to getting those dollars. is this pipeline specifically going to work on behalf of the fishing industry on BC’sCoast? I guess my idea is how does the gas and oil sector paid specific dollars into a separate fund that goes directly to benefitting the pacific fishery ? It’s possible that that’s already happening and I just don’t know about it but if it isn’t this was an opportunity to tap into a huge revenue stream granted it’s a gas and oil pipeline but the reality is it’s probably going to be completed and fully functional in the not-too-distant future and as an industry we need to benefit from that !

 

[browningmirage]

So we benefit for a few years until the steady March of climate change creates conditions that are beyond the adaptive capacity of these fish. Ocean conditions impossible, river temperatures in the high 20s. Fish literally unable to muster the energy to swim under the metabolic stress.

Because we gave up and said "ok, give us the pipeline" and were/are complicit in the climate change our future holds.

I dont want dirty money paying to placate me while they ruin my fishery.

 

[calmsea]

So you suggest selling out to the greasy oil kingpins? Think about your proposal again when one of these many oil tankers breaks open and renders large stretches of coast unliveable for any kind of life.

 

[SpringVelocity]

This has nothing to do with just trans mountain. This problem has been going on this province for years. It stems from several issues under the provincial liberal government under Clark and under the federal government under Harper.

When the fisheries protections were gutted by Harper making it easier to approve industrial projects it essentially gave the power of enforcement to the provinces. As a result it stripped the power from federal government. Despite what you heard it is not fixed.

To make matters worse the province wanted to shield itself from being liable for these projects going in so it created the professional reliance model. Basically the ministry of environment or any other ministry like mines would oversee a project but would use the data and science from independent contractors. That would be weighted heavily with the environmental review board whether a project goes ahead or not.

Then there is Environment Canada. First we only have like I believe 3 environment Canada officers for enforcement I think in Vancouver Island and mainland. Trudeau has not moved on adding more and they run on little funding. They have limited power for enforcement as the province really has the power.

The division of government with riparian assessments sort of works on it's own. So that's an issue. Many times riparians sometimes arent done where they should have. Many times it's because the independent contra cters dont think they need one. Moe consistantly doesn't follow up where it should. Again the flaw of the Pro reliance model again.

Lastly the ministry of environment has really the same culture and management as the previous liberal government. The government shifted but ministry staff remained.

Until the environment Canada officers can do there job, moe has a significant culture shift, moe gets rid of the professional reliance model , moe gets increased staffing for enfocement , and the riparian section of the government can actually do its job this is going to continue.

So no I am not surprised about Trans mountain. Its typical of projects across the province.

 

[walleyes]

https://nationalpost.com/news/canad...blaming-canadas-sky-high-emissions-on-alberta

 

[part time]

Thanks to Power Set for making some great suggestions, and to Walleys for putting this pipeline controversy into perspective ... So how do we capitalize on oil & gas $$ to rebuild & restore our marine environment on the west coast ?
I have to give some of the native bands credit for trying to get a piece of the pipeline action .. Good on them .. Maybe they have some ideas that'll help the west coast ..

 

[Fishing?]

How many rail derailments happen each year? The fact that the question can even be asked should be alarming to the anti pipeline crowd.
How many pipeline accidents? Have to look over periods of years for that answer.

So if these anti pipeline group is about saving the environment and fish habitat and other "green" issues then why are they causing an extra 2 or 3 hundred thousand more rail oil tankers to run along the rivers when rail accidents are much more frequent.

Possible scenario - YAaa, no pipeline but two rail accidents have sterilized the Fraser and Thompson rivers, caused many communities drinking water problems, destroyed the native/commercial/sports fisheries, maybe even cause sturgeon to go extinct.

For every bad outcome the pipeline crowd says may happen, it is 1000's of times worse if a single rail car derails and leaks or just simply leaks period.

Damn it what happened to common sense?

Just double wall the pipe.

 

[walleyes]

Makes you scratch your head some days doesn't it.

 

[SpringVelocity]

Industrial projects can't just do what they want or get a free pass to do what they please if the province allows it too destroy salmon enhancement/ breaks rules, and FYI not against the project at all.

We need industry here.

 

[Dave]

The only thing stopping this pipeline from completion is the buy in by the opposing FN. When that happens, the American funded activists will pack up and find a new cause elsewhere.
I have to think it has a better chance of completion if the TMP is owned by First Nations.

 

[Jwolfe]

Bad logging practices ,the construction of new roads and urban development have destroyed more fish habitat then any pipeline ever will ,the sad truth is that these people that protest pipelines ignore the problems that they’re a part of and happily point the finger at some one else.I don’t see them stopping the flow of raw sewage piped by the hundreds millions of litres a day right into the feeding grounds of our precious orcas or try and stop the whale watching boats that chase them around everyday ,this can’t be more disruptive then having a extra 4 tankers a day visit our port no no .Hey we could cut the visits of over 400 cruise ships a year that stop in our port while disrupting our orcas dumping their sewage and burning the emissions equivalent of one million cars a year . Just remember snow flakes -that road you drive on that house you live in has displaced or killed more then one living thing and you should be ashamed of yourselves

 

[browningmirage]

Bad logging practices ,the construction of new roads and urban development have destroyed more fish habitat then any pipeline ever will ,the sad truth is that these people that protest pipelines ignore the problems that they’re a part of and happily point the finger at some one else.I don’t see them stopping the flow of raw sewage piped by the hundreds millions of litres a day right into the feeding grounds of our precious orcas or try and stop the whale watching boats that chase them around everyday ,this can’t be more disruptive then having a extra 4 tankers a day visit our port no no .Hey we could cut the visits of over 400 cruise ships a year that stop in our port while disrupting our orcas dumping their sewage and burning the emissions equivalent of one million cars a year . Just remember snow flakes -that road you drive on that house you live in has displaced or killed more then one living thing and you should be ashamed of yourselves

Man you'd think us snowflakes are idiots with no ability to think.

Its funny how the arguments work. Oil pipelines are safer than rail.

Ok, so we put in the pipeline, and there is no increase in production or exports; we produce transport oil and there is no increase in risk.

Oh but wait, we are capitalists. Increased capacity means we need to meet that capacity. Having this pipeline wont mean less trains, it will mean more oil transported. More oil transported means more ships. Means more CO2. Means more risk. Dont pretend otherwise.

Risks are additive. Some years, we see excellent survival because for some reason the stars aligned and some factor(s) were not as limiting as previous.

We keep down this road of increasing fossil fuels, there is no escape. Climate change is the great equalizer. Fish adapted to 15 degree water cant survive in 20. Go ahead and support fossil fuel expansion. I dont. I recognize my impacts, but I am pushing for a better future. The only thing holding us back is the failure to recognize and invest in alternative energy.

Because our salmon cant out last climate change. It's too much and too fast.

 

[SpringVelocity]

I think we have drifted so far from topic it is not funny.

This article shows what Transmountain project has done in an instance of salmon creek. The issue isn't whether we want pipeline or not. That is what it is pointing out. What is being shown is that EAB and MoE somehow approved that. I mean come on.

Somehow if anyone says hey that isn't right in salmon stream they are anti oil or snowflake. We need to get our head out if our butt so to speak. You guys fish?

There is nothing wrong with industrial projects as long as they make sense and the government enforces the building of them with proper engineering and science.

Look at that picture you would have to be foolish to approve. Guaranteed no riparian assessment was done with QEP. That shows we still need work to do in the approval process across our province. And the issue is again what is MOE doing?

 

[Jwolfe]

I here people talking about the emissions caused by the use of fossil fuels from the pipelines, but at the same time they seem to be ignoring that the port of tsawwassen is the largest exporter of coal in North America witch a mass majority is American coal ,why are the pipeline haters turning a blind eye to this ? These ships exporting this coal are disrupting our orcas and at the same time contributing to the largest emitter of co2 in the world ,I wonder if they know this and choose to ignore or are they just so narrow minded they don’t see it,To the wood burning hypocrites you make me sick along with this planet

 

[terrin]

I here people talking about the emissions caused by the use of fossil fuels from the pipelines, but at the same time they seem to be ignoring that the port of tsawwassen is the largest exporter of coal in North America witch a mass majority is American coal ,why are the pipeline haters turning a blind eye to this ? These ships exporting this coal are disrupting our orcas and at the same time contributing to the largest emitter of co2 in the world ,I wonder if they know this and choose to ignore or are they just so narrow minded they don’t see it,To the wood burning hypocrites you make me sick along with this planet

What do you think China will do with Bitumen? The winds blow back and we get to breath the nasty crap in the air. Take a look. No Thanks