Requesting forum advise: 14" offset kicker tie bar setup

[seabeyond]

I'd like to add a kicker to keep some hours off the mains. I can't see how I'd get a conventional tie bar to work with the major offset.

The kicker bracket has a 14" offset from the mains. It's about 30" between kicker and stbd engine mounting center.

The most economic and functional option I see standing here is a seastar cable tie bar. I'm certainly not set on this option. I also don't know how to size the seastar cable tie bar if anyone has experience with sizing that system.

I don't really want to extend the bracket 10" to bring the motors more in line (although I'd sure prefer a conventional tie bar. It's currently 14" off the transom which I believe is sufficient clearance. Don't want to add more strain on the kicker mount or push the weight further aft if I don't need to.

All thoughts appreciated.

 

[Captain PartyMarty]

Have you checked out the seastar cable tie bar it might work for this application.

 

[seabeyond]

Have you checked out the seastar cable tie bar it might work for this application.

Yes, that's my default if someone doesn't have a better idea. I'd be happy to avoid the cable potential issues but might be the best option.

 

[Squire]

A tie-bar from the front of your kicker cowling to your Seastar steering cylinder may work?

 

[Captain PartyMarty]

Remove the old kicker bracket and have a longer one made would be my preferred option. New bracket likely cost less than a cable or liquid tie bar

 

[chille51]

I think you can probably fabricate something up if you put your mind to it. My Arima has kind of the opposite problem - main sits further forward than the kicker by a good deal. I connected the Seastar like Squire suggested, and bent some 3/8" stainless rod to match the length and geometry. Took some trial and error but works just fine now. I used inexpensive aluminum rod I could bend by hand to get the basic idea of what geometry would work, and then bent the stainless once. The fact that is threaded let's me make micro adjustments to the overall length by just threading the fitting on with a stop nut adjusted to the right position.

 

[chille51]

Not the best picture but general idea. The pool noodle is just so it floats if I accidentally drop it in.

 

[Brando]

I had the cable tie bar for years no complaints and it’s still in use on the boat now. I seem to remember adding some sort of tilt tube grease nut at the same time but I don’t think it’s necessary just seemed like a good idea. Here’s how to measure.


Edit- here’s the nut for the tilt tube

Davis Lube II | Poco Marine | Vancouver

The Davis lube II allows sticky, hard to move steering rods to be properly and easily lubricated for smooth, easy steering action. Buy this lubricating nut!

www.pocomarine.com

 

[seabeyond]

I had the cable tie bar for years no complaints and it’s still in use on the boat now. I seem to remember adding some sort of tilt tube grease nut at the same time but I don’t think it’s necessary just seemed like a good idea. Here’s how to measure.

View attachment 114230
Edit- here’s the nut for the tilt tube

Davis Lube II | Poco Marine | Vancouver

The Davis lube II allows sticky, hard to move steering rods to be properly and easily lubricated for smooth, easy steering action. Buy this lubricating nut!

www.pocomarine.com

Thank you Brando.
Building in the grease nipple is a good idea. I'll make that addition if this is the way I go. Appreciate the insight from someone who's owned the setup.

 

[seabeyond]

I think you can probably fabricate something up if you put your mind to it. My Arima has kind of the opposite problem - main sits further forward than the kicker by a good deal. I connected the Seastar like Squire suggested, and bent some 3/8" stainless rod to match the length and geometry. Took some trial and error but works just fine now. I used inexpensive aluminum rod I could bend by hand to get the basic idea of what geometry would work, and then bent the stainless once. The fact that is threaded let's me make micro adjustments to the overall length by just threading the fitting on with a stop nut adjusted to the right position.

Not the best picture but general idea. The pool noodle is just so it floats if I accidentally drop it in.

View attachment 114229

I like the simplicity of a tie bar once installed. That's a significant offset. Do you find you get enough steering range with your setup? I thought that I might not get enough range trying this approach. I guess there's two mains in the water as rudders that will aid in the process.

How's the tiller controls worked out? I'm tempted to go tiller and an aftermarket rpm control as I have had issues with the mercury control boxes in the weather. It'll be a prokicker..

 

[wolf]

There is always a way especially fab one, ive built a few you can get quite ingenius doing bends etc ive always had good luck with threaded bar and the ends that thread in. The ball and socket type

https://www.amazon.ca/Pieces-4inch-Throttle-Linkage-Stainless/dp/B07SBW3S6Q/ref=sr_1_2?crid=3F373NNYCWSUF&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Rkv7VgQ3JgLep5sszsCaBv1paudDtu_A_owCbpJ5FlY8sTFC6nIa9XREko11AU_o2qdFb0gbnjXiEF-sZUV4_fGrV8SqWkDXh1rBYq46P6yyN6Syx0Qglrwx1YelsQEPDYb87U7075IsJc-B4NyNhTPBBzpch0MoYE8j3N5gEEzvDyDjmYJZQFXRNt6DeA-tHgm7sZkAt5b8IqqZDyuvW7s_BW-bbSHcKx6o9mC6gSYefo5dfhnSQ8oTmvfO1mEkXjcXscJxbUQZVGt1XMPSaN1fkjWbNAIg110TMRh3Pw23WXnRjJUwCuOdMSkO8Kzb.LXq8gPsqUWHwsAnF9YxCGApD_L3C69PAw1aD2hBOHJU&dib_tag=se&keywords=ball+and+socket+tie+bar+ends+marine&qid=1737989669&sprefix=ball+and+socket+tie+bar+ends+marine%2Caps%2C125&sr=8-2

 

[Buckethead905]

The seastar cable system is def going to work best for your application, especially if you don’t want to connect/disconnect the tie bar every time you tilt the kicker and move spots.

 

[Brando]

Thank you Brando.
Building in the grease nipple is a good idea. I'll make that addition if this is the way I go. Appreciate the insight from someone who's owned the setup.

Your other option is to add a liquid tie bar and the valve.

 

[chille51]

I like the simplicity of a tie bar once installed. That's a significant offset. Do you find you get enough steering range with your setup? I thought that I might not get enough range trying this approach. I guess there's two mains in the water as rudders that will aid in the process.

How's the tiller controls worked out? I'm tempted to go tiller and an aftermarket rpm control as I have had issues with the mercury control boxes in the weather. It'll be a prokicker..

It did take some trial and error to get it dialed in, but once I did its got enough turning range for me. When I first did it I could turn to starboard no problem but port was a struggle. I had the setup biased over to starboard a little too much. That is to say overall length of the tie bar was a little too short. I use the same type of fittings that Wolf posted above, with a nylock threaded onto the rod below them. So I can make fine adjustments of the overall length by loosening the nylock and either threading the fitting further down the rod or further towards the end - we're talking millimeters of adjustment here, but that's all it took to straighten out my turning issue. Now it is equal either direction and the main turns lock to lock. Of course, the kicker on its own has a wider range than the tie bar allows, but so far it has worked in any conditions I wanted to fish in. If I was turning against a fast current maybe would be an issue, but there are multiple options to give it some help. I can goose the throttle on the kicker, or pop the tie bar off momentarily and turn with the tiller, or worst case fire up the main for a second and give it the extra thrust. Never have had to do any of those, but could if need be.

My setup does need to come off to tilt the kicker if that matters to you. Its an easy quick release - takes literally 5 seconds to take on or off on the water. I like having the tiller steer on the kicker if I want it - I often just do that if fishing solo and don't use the tie bar at all.

I have a Trollmaster at the helm for RPM control when using the tie bar, or I can just use the tiller throttle. And finally I have troll control on the main too, so no shortage of options.

 

[seabeyond]

It did take some trial and error to get it dialed in, but once I did its got enough turning range for me. When I first did it I could turn to starboard no problem but port was a struggle. I had the setup biased over to starboard a little too much. That is to say overall length of the tie bar was a little too short. I use the same type of fittings that Wolf posted above, with a nylock threaded onto the rod below them. So I can make fine adjustments of the overall length by loosening the nylock and either threading the fitting further down the rod or further towards the end - we're talking millimeters of adjustment here, but that's all it took to straighten out my turning issue. Now it is equal either direction and the main turns lock to lock. Of course, the kicker on its own has a wider range than the tie bar allows, but so far it has worked in any conditions I wanted to fish in. If I was turning against a fast current maybe would be an issue, but there are multiple options to give it some help. I can goose the throttle on the kicker, or pop the tie bar off momentarily and turn with the tiller, or worst case fire up the main for a second and give it the extra thrust. Never have had to do any of those, but could if need be.

My setup does need to come off to tilt the kicker if that matters to you. Its an easy quick release - takes literally 5 seconds to take on or off on the water. I like having the tiller steer on the kicker if I want it - I often just do that if fishing solo and don't use the tie bar at all.

I have a Trollmaster at the helm for RPM control when using the tie bar, or I can just use the tiller throttle. And finally I have troll control on the main too, so no shortage of options.

Thanks for the above.

How have you found the trollmaster?

 

[chille51]

Trollmaster is ok. Its a little glitchy sometimes - surges and then settles down again when you adjust it. Was pretty finicky to get the right setting on the servo arm to maximize throttle range at first. Again, trial and error and really need to have it on the water to see how it will react, which is not the place to make the adjustments. So took a few outings for me to get results I was happy with. I should mention I bought mine used and its one of the older models, so who knows how long it was in service before I got it. A brand new one might be a whole other story.

 

[wolf]

I will add to what ive posted that I put a bullet float on the bar too just incase it falls over board the kind they use on gill nets small torpedo type. Also if you find its "rattles " a bit on the ball and socket I found that you make a washer out of fuel line and slide over the ball end and cut the said washer to whatever thickness ya need and add a lil grease to it ...

Good luck Wolf

 

[Olde School]

I will add to what ive posted that I put a bullet float on the bar too just incase it falls over board the kind they use on gill nets small torpedo type. Also if you find its "rattles " a bit on the ball and socket I found that you make a washer out of fuel line and slide over the ball end and cut the said washer to whatever thickness ya need and add a lil grease to it ...

Good luck Wolf

Hey Wolf, will you add a picture of that solution please? I've been gluing a small o-ring inside the socket end of the ball & socket but this only helps a little bit and only for a short time. Thanks in advance.

 

[pescador]

Seastar kicker Cable Tie Bar. You don’t need to look any further. I’ve played around with different options over the last 20 years. This thing is dialled in. It’ll deal with almost any offset. Never bend over your boat again connecting s#ht. Steering amazing. Bullet proof. Expensive but worth every dollar. Just make sure you keep it well lubed and don’t ever bump the tube into the dock.

 

[wolf]

Hey Wolf, will you add a picture of that solution please? I've been gluing a small o-ring inside the socket end of the ball & socket but this only helps a little bit and only for a short time. Thanks in advance.

I havent used that system in a while but quite easy whatever ball you have it may be 3/8 or 5/16 cut a washer whatever desired thickness you need to make it stop rattling from, could be 1/4 inch thick to a sliver all depends on the application. I used fuel line as its way tougher. just slide it over top of ball . You want it slightly compressed on the ball and socket..

Good luck Wolf