Powering Pot Pullers Properly

L

Lucky Tiger

Member
ha now that I have your attention.. I keep having trouble with motors failing on my King Fushion puller and an looking at ways to power a new one. I pull two commercial traps in the current from 400 ft. and more. I don't like putting all those hours on the main engine and the kicker needs high rpm to keep up sooooo what about running a generator on board with dc to power the puller or ac to an ac motor/ hydraulics, ac to dc battery charger with high amp output etc. Anybody got any ideas??? Thanks Perry
 
Can sell your old unit to Cuba Libra as he always seems to need parts or his... :)
 
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Are you killing batteries or the motors? How is the generator going to save the motor from burning out anyway?

I definitely would not run a generator to power an electric motor on the boat. Too inefficient. If you are going to put another gas motor onboard, why wouldn't you just get a honda with a capstan on it and pull directly off the shaft?
 
Lucky Tiger said:
ha now that I have your attention.. I keep having trouble with motors failing on my King Fushion puller and an looking at ways to power a new one... Anybody got any ideas??? Thanks Perry
Click to expand...

One reason motors fail is because the wiring to them is too light. The Ace that I use, for example, is rated at 30 amps which means it needs 10 ga. wiring to it - heavier than needed for the standard Scotty down riggers. Worth checking it. We always have the big motor running at high idle when we use the trap puller - just an idea.
 
Foxsea said:
One reason motors fail is because the wiring to them is too light. The Ace that I use, for example, is rated at 30 amps which means it needs 10 ga. wiring to it - heavier than needed for the standard Scotty down riggers. Worth checking it. We always have the big motor running at high idle when we use the trap puller - just an idea.
Click to expand...

I don't see it...Have you ever checked the wire that's on your Ace? It's like 14-16ga. Even Scotty I think is only 14ga. What distance from the battery are we talking about? My boat is wired with tinned 12ga and its just fine and I only run one battery and my Ace hauler with 8 traps 2 per line and 600 ft of line. That's 2400 feet of load line some times twice a day.

Both Scotty riggers and Ace haulers are rated for 30amps no? Scotty recommends an inline 30amp fuse.

Perry before buying a generator borrow my Ace and give it a try.
 
My Scotties were already on my boat when I purchased it. For a while after I purchased an Ace, I had problems with my Ace occasionally shutting down when the load wasn't that great. I ended up discovering that my Scotties were wired with 15 amp breakers (in my case, each has a separate circuit breaker vs. fuse at the battery switch). Shutdown issues ended as soon as I switched them out for 30 amp breakers.
 
As an electrical engineer, and former boat owner with similar problems, I will concur with the statements above. The gauge of wiring, voltage on the batteries, and distance of wire run will all have some affect with any electrical motor, or any other equipment on a boat that may have a DC/DC converter.

-Longer wire run means higher wire resistance (and lower voltage as measured at the motor terminals)
-smaller gauge wire means higher wire resistance as well (and same result as above)

Given the motor needs some power rating, higher resistance or a low battery means you pull more current through the same wire. Higher current through the same wire tends to burn it out faster, which in turn creates higher resistance and need to pull even more current. If the ends of those wires are not bright new clean copper color, you may have this problem.

Easy answer is to overkill on the wire gauge, and keep the run of wire short. Thick gauge wire can be expensive, so keep the run short or spend $$$.
 
Fish Assassin said:
I don't see it...Have you ever checked the wire that's on your Ace? It's like 14-16ga. Even Scotty I think is only 14ga. What distance from the battery are we talking about? My boat is wired with tinned 12ga and its just fine and I only run one battery and my Ace hauler with 8 traps 2 per line and 600 ft of line. That's 2400 feet of load line some times twice a day.

Both Scotty riggers and Ace haulers are rated for 30amps no? Scotty recommends an inline 30amp fuse.

Perry before buying a generator borrow my Ace and give it a try.
Click to expand...

Scotty says:
Use good quality marine grade tinned electrical wire to bring power to your
downrigger. To determine the correct gauge of wire, measure the “wire run
length” which is the distance from the positive (+) power source connection,
to your downrigger and back to the negative (-) power source connection.
For wire run lengths up to 25 feet use minimum 12 Ga. wire, for runs of 25
– 40 feet use 10 Ga. wire. Wire smaller than the recommended gauge will
not carry sufficient power to operate your downrigger at its rated speed and
power, it will run noticeably slower.
http://www.scotty.com/scotty-support/documents/ED_ManualRev1007.pdf

ABYC says to 10 gauge for up to 10 feet at 30 amps will give a 3% voltage drop.
http://bluesea.com/viewresource/1437
 
Foxsea said:
Scotty says:
Use good quality marine grade tinned electrical wire to bring power to your
downrigger. To determine the correct gauge of wire, measure the “wire run
length” which is the distance from the positive (+) power source connection,
to your downrigger and back to the negative (-) power source connection.
For wire run lengths up to 25 feet use minimum 12 Ga. wire, for runs of 25
– 40 feet use 10 Ga. wire. Wire smaller than the recommended gauge will
not carry sufficient power to operate your downrigger at its rated speed and
power, it will run noticeably slower.
http://www.scotty.com/scotty-support/documents/ED_ManualRev1007.pdf

ABYC says to 10 gauge for up to 10 feet at 30 amps will give a 3% voltage drop.
http://bluesea.com/viewresource/1437
Click to expand...


Is your puller and riggers mounted on your bow?

Just had a electrician at my house today testing amps and volts. I am good to go. Running puller without motors running I am at about 11.7v. Hanging off my puller well holding a towel on the main drum almost stoping it 24 amps. Fuse still good. And as many as you know I am not a small guy hanging off that drum. I have about 10 feet of tinned 12-2 on each side of my boat with inline 30amp fuses.
 
Fish Assassin said:
Is your puller and riggers mounted on your bow?
Click to expand...
ha ha!

Fish Assassin said:
... I have about 10 feet of tinned 12-2 on each side of my boat with inline 30amp fuses.
Click to expand...
Your system sounds ideal. One side on mine is about 5 feet from the battery and the other side is more like 14' (battery to distribution panel and then to plug).
 
I forgot to mention that all things between the battery and any electric motor will drop resistance. This includes fuses, fuse holders, battery switch, any other switch, wire crimps. Also, anything with corrosion (greenish blue color) is a sign of another voltage drop. Keep fuse panels inside a cab if you can, or use lots of dielectric grease out on the deck. If I had a choice, it would be to keep it simple, straight connection to battery and short wire run.

Without knowing the exact power ratings, I'd recommend 8ft or less at 10 gauge for heavy pulling, and nothing but wire between battery switch and motor. That's just my 2c though.
 
Ok... One side of my boat is about 4-5 feet away from battery the other side is about 8 feet away. Both sides are cut about 10 feet. Every connection is greased with dielectric and heat shrunk if not both.

10ga is over kill so is everything that has been done on my boat. That's why I don't have problems.
 
thanks for the input. I have wired the puller directly from the battery with at least 8/10 gauge wire but not tinned and thru a 40amp + breaker but still have had problems with the motor overheating. I have used the Ace hauler a few times to get my traps up after the king fushiion failed but found it slow and a lot of needed help to pull the traps up. I am looking for the perfect puller and leaning to the honda 4 hp gas puller.
 
I would guess that it says to use a 30 amp fuse because of the inrush current a motor has on start up. The current spikes in the the first couple cycles when the most torque is required to get the thing going. If the factory size wiring had the fuse rated at the max current (15A for 14g wire) you'd likely blow that fuse every time you turned it on. There's code specs that allow you run way over on your fuse size for motor loads in certain cases. Either way what ever wire it comes with or tells is fine but like exterminator says it never hurts anything to step up your conductor size. You need to be careful when going to big with your fuses as well big currents can be tough on the motor windings.
 
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Lucky Tiger said:
thanks for the input. I have wired the puller directly from the battery with at least 8/10 gauge wire but not tinned and thru a 40amp + breaker but still have had problems with the motor overheating. I have used the Ace hauler a few times to get my traps up after the king fushiion failed but found it slow and a lot of needed help to pull the traps up. I am looking for the perfect puller and leaning to the honda 4 hp gas puller.
Click to expand...
Perry give mine a try... You don't have to assist it at all. Just turn it on and watch it do all the work. The only thing you need to do is hit the on/off switch.
 
thanks for the offer Owen but that would still put a lot of hours on the big motor. We usually go to the cabin with four people and max traps each pulling 300ft twice a day till we are limited out. It makes sense to me to run a 4hp Honda engine on a puller than the 225hp and do a better job. Now does anybody now where I could buy one?? There is a place in the states on the internet but shipping cost are nuts 200.00+
 
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