From todays TC
- Thread starter totally tyee
- Start date
victoriaboater
Active Member
Scarey stuff...
fishin_magician
Well-Known Member
yeah, we're in big trouble. Just cuz one year is on and one is "off" that's a warning sign....a BIG early warning sign..and the disappearance of wild coho is an indicator too...
N
nine eyes deep
Guest
Another little thing people dont realize is that the major logging companies took the private land out of the tfl. Thus putting the private land into a totally different set of logging practices and rules. I engineer for Island Timberlands on private land and I havent worked outside of a watershed or major fish creek in a year and a half. My partner and I have personally taken a few hundred hectares off of the banks of china creek. Why do you think Port Alberni is constantly under a water restriction? It is because natural slides and windthrown trees create siltation and have nothing to stop them and they make their way to the creeks. Yes I do believe global warming has something to do with fish disappearence, but maybe we should concentrate on the problem we have at home. Destruction of our prime spawning habitat will kill the fish stocks long before global warming.
Tailspin
Active Member
The forest practices board is just so helpful too with current legislation! Even the buffer zones in fish bearing creeks are not adhered to.The list goes on, look at Lake Cowichans private land pilaging off Shaw Main. Fines are cheaper to the developer's than the desired outcome. Also Shawnigan Creek going into South Shawnigan Lake. You should see the Nitnat river from above on the ATV's, that is if you can winch over all the neat lil' gates popping up everywhere, substantial amounts of destructive clearing there. 6 Acre Lots for sale on the riverfront as well. Sorry for the rant! To see that on the front page of the TC sure makes the necessary closures and the reality of the future sink in deep[xx(]
Time is near to sell the big rides and settle into a 14 foot tinner for trout. Then of course a weekend Wakeboard Boat to sit on the lake in our own septicity drinking beer! Sign of the times is all to near[:0]. I won't even get into what news(rumours) the Commercial boyz are dealing with.Lets just say there may be a few more 40' flower planters in a few front yards.[V]
Time is near to sell the big rides and settle into a 14 foot tinner for trout. Then of course a weekend Wakeboard Boat to sit on the lake in our own septicity drinking beer! Sign of the times is all to near[:0]. I won't even get into what news(rumours) the Commercial boyz are dealing with.Lets just say there may be a few more 40' flower planters in a few front yards.[V]
Whole in the Water
Well-Known Member
I agree that climate change is a big factor now. However, fish numbers have been declining for over 20 years and this in my opinion is due to:
- destruction of fish habitat and spawing grounds due to poor logging practices around water bodies for over 100 years,
-destruction of habitat and spawning grounds due to urban development (especially on the east coast of Vancouver Island),
- over fishing salmon and bait fish by the commerical fleets in the past (e.g. herring fishing in Georgia Strait),
- total mismangement of fisheries by the DFO (e.g. they just refused to support a ban of drag net fishing off the BC Coast).
My fear is that DFO will use climate change as a convenient excuse to cover up their gross incompetance over the last 30 years.
That's my two bits worth!
- destruction of fish habitat and spawing grounds due to poor logging practices around water bodies for over 100 years,
-destruction of habitat and spawning grounds due to urban development (especially on the east coast of Vancouver Island),
- over fishing salmon and bait fish by the commerical fleets in the past (e.g. herring fishing in Georgia Strait),
- total mismangement of fisheries by the DFO (e.g. they just refused to support a ban of drag net fishing off the BC Coast).
My fear is that DFO will use climate change as a convenient excuse to cover up their gross incompetance over the last 30 years.
That's my two bits worth!
fishin_magician
Well-Known Member
quote:Originally posted by Whole in the Water
I agree that climate change is a big factor now. However, fish numbers have been declining for over 20 years and this in my opinion is due to:
- destruction of fish habitat and spawing grounds due to poor logging practices around water bodies for over 100 years,
-destruction of habitat and spawning grounds due to urban development (especially on the east coast of Vancouver Island),
- over fishing salmon and bait fish by the commerical fleets in the past (e.g. herring fishing in Georgia Strait),
- total mismangement of fisheries by the DFO (e.g. they just refused to support a ban of drag net fishing off the BC Coast).
My fear is that DFO will use climate change as a convenient excuse to cover up their gross incompetance over the last 30 years.
That's my two bits worth!
In your post, in no where did you cite sportfishers (saltwater and freshwater) and Natives as having anything to do with the salmon stock issues.
We're responsible too!
scott craven
Well-Known Member
Sportfisher's represent a drop in the bucket when pitted against
the devastation of spawning rivers by logging, urban sprawl, and
mismanagement of the resource.
Our fee's also contribute to enhancement on the rivers, where there
is no contribution from other violater's.
I am not naieve enought to believe we have no effect, however
if the river's were adequately protected there would be a huge
rebound in salmon stocks.
the devastation of spawning rivers by logging, urban sprawl, and
mismanagement of the resource.
Our fee's also contribute to enhancement on the rivers, where there
is no contribution from other violater's.
I am not naieve enought to believe we have no effect, however
if the river's were adequately protected there would be a huge
rebound in salmon stocks.
wolf
Well-Known Member
You will never get the logging companys to say oooppps did we do something wrong???? when NDP was in power there was accountability to the logging companies now the liberals are in whats the first thing they do throw out the conservation and logging act and make the logging company self govern there regulations and themselves.
What a crock of cow dung thats like letting the fox look after the hen house I go out hunting a lot on the island and what I see is bad they log right down and across streams but its so far back its "out of sight out of mind" mentallity,Why do you think they do NOT allow access into leech town and weeks lake area now hhhhmmmmmmmm I wonder!!!!!!
Every where you go its locked up tight they dont want joe public to see what they are doing and this government could care less....
My Rant for the day Wolf
Thanks
What a crock of cow dung thats like letting the fox look after the hen house I go out hunting a lot on the island and what I see is bad they log right down and across streams but its so far back its "out of sight out of mind" mentallity,Why do you think they do NOT allow access into leech town and weeks lake area now hhhhmmmmmmmm I wonder!!!!!!
Every where you go its locked up tight they dont want joe public to see what they are doing and this government could care less....
My Rant for the day Wolf
Thanks
Shermanater
Member
Look at the Nanaimo river right now. It's low and very murky. Even the Nanaimo lakes are mud puddles. Wonder why???
P
Pablo2079
Guest
That's where I think Washington and Oregon might do a little better job in protecting salmon. There are more people walking around in the woods, so there is less "out of sight, out of mind" going on. Maybe it's a false impression of mine.
It's hard not to choke when you see the B.C. tagline.... Super Natural..... ummmmm... yeah... or when talking to Americans and they bring up the lack of sewage treatment for Victoria.
It's hard not to choke when you see the B.C. tagline.... Super Natural..... ummmmm... yeah... or when talking to Americans and they bring up the lack of sewage treatment for Victoria.
M
Mongoose
Guest
hey wolf that was some good white tail sausages. we all liked it
walleyes
Well-Known Member
Point fingers where you want but the main reasons our fish stocks being down,,,
#1, over fishing from commercial boats.
#2, native fisheries in spawning rivers
#3, Environment changes.. ( fish will adapt)
#4, sport fisherman..
Work from the top down you will maintain a good healthy fish stock....
#1, over fishing from commercial boats.
#2, native fisheries in spawning rivers
#3, Environment changes.. ( fish will adapt)
#4, sport fisherman..
Work from the top down you will maintain a good healthy fish stock....
N
nine eyes deep
Guest
Fish wont adapt to spawning bed that has been filled in with silt. I agree that there is over commercial fishing and once a salmon reaches the river it should be left alone to do its thing.
P
Pablo2079
Guest
Good point 9 eyes.... if the habitat is gone, everything else becomes moot.
G
Gooey Bob
Guest
You're all forgetting perhaps the key issue - ocean survival. IMHO this is the main reason we're seing dramatic declines in some species particularly in the South Coast.
Think of it this way:
As recently as 10 years ago, the survival rate of a smolt entering the ocean to a returning adult was in the neighborhood of 10 to 20% for most Vancouver Island streams. For 2006 Black Creek and the Little Q will post survival rates of less than 1%!
So, if 100,000 smolts left the river in 1998, we could expect an average of 15,000 adults to return at 15% survival.
Now, if 100,000 smolts leave the river in 2003 at 0.5% survival, then only 500 return.
Get it?
I know its a lot easier to point fingers at nasty loggers and commercial fishermen - and yes, we all are partly to blame - but its the tough nut of ocean survival thats playing havoc right now. Hard to fix for sure, but lets hope that the fish are able to adapt or that things turn around out there in the open ocean.
On a happier note, it seems that Chinook survival rates pretty much Coast Wide are at or above the 10 year average. I sure hope that continues!
Gooey.
Gooey.
Think of it this way:
As recently as 10 years ago, the survival rate of a smolt entering the ocean to a returning adult was in the neighborhood of 10 to 20% for most Vancouver Island streams. For 2006 Black Creek and the Little Q will post survival rates of less than 1%!
So, if 100,000 smolts left the river in 1998, we could expect an average of 15,000 adults to return at 15% survival.
Now, if 100,000 smolts leave the river in 2003 at 0.5% survival, then only 500 return.
Get it?
I know its a lot easier to point fingers at nasty loggers and commercial fishermen - and yes, we all are partly to blame - but its the tough nut of ocean survival thats playing havoc right now. Hard to fix for sure, but lets hope that the fish are able to adapt or that things turn around out there in the open ocean.
On a happier note, it seems that Chinook survival rates pretty much Coast Wide are at or above the 10 year average. I sure hope that continues!
Gooey.
Gooey.
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