Changes to Ucluelet Govie Moorage

[searun]

A heads up for Guides looking to get moorage this summer in Ukie.

Transport Canada met with the staff in Ucluelet and said there could be liability concerns for the port for operators without the Blue decal program in place. Ucluelet are now moving to a policy that requires all vessels to be registered and operating under the blue decal program.

For those that flat our refuse to conform you will be denied moorage in any of the facility's ran by the village of Ucluelet.

 

[Hindsight]

A heads up for Guides looking to get moorage this summer in Ukie.

Transport Canada met with the staff in Ucluelet and said there could be liability concerns for the port for operators without the Blue decal program in place. Ucluelet are now moving to a policy that requires all vessels to be registered and operating under the blue decal program.

For those that flat our refuse to conform you will be denied moorage in any of the facility's ran by the village of Ucluelet.

I wish we could do the same, but all privates docks in this area

 

[kanuckle head]

I wish we could do the same, but all privates docks in this area

Sounds like another grab, for the work'n boyz
They already have enough rules to meet transport Can. regs to take clients out on the WCVI, let alone the insurance to operate, the rize'n fuel cost & the slow economy with the par US coin

 

[beemer]

I wish we could do the same, but all privates docks in this area

Hey Hourston , you should point out to the dock owners that they WILL be named in any legal suit that involves a commercial enterprise that operates from their marina. If the operator doesn't have enough insurance for paying guests (if they don't have the correct certs , they won't) the marina or dock owner will pay.

Any well run marina doesn't allow unlicensed commercial operations , if they do they are fools!

beemer

 

[searun]

Better to get on board with TC than try to skirt around. If you don't have your full qualifications some insurance companies will not sell you liability insurance. Some are now giving discounts based on your qualifications - especially CTAG. Its not like this TC stuff just happened yesterday, but some folks figured it wouldn't affect them. Now with this change it will have a few guys scrambling to get going. Not impossible to get ready, especially knowing this is happening in the coming season.

 

[Hit em Hard]

A heads up for Guides looking to get moorage this summer in Ukie.

Transport Canada met with the staff in Ucluelet and said there could be liability concerns for the port for operators without the Blue decal program in place. Ucluelet are now moving to a policy that requires all vessels to be registered and operating under the blue decal program.

For those that flat our refuse to conform you will be denied moorage in any of the facility's ran by the village of Ucluelet.

I assume this refers to charter operators and not private sport fishers. Does anyone know? I am not really familiar with the Blue Decal Program.

H.E.H.

 

[IronNoggin]

Transport Canada met with the staff in Ucluelet and said there could be liability concerns for the port for operators without the Blue decal program in place. Ucluelet are now moving to a policy that requires all vessels to be registered and operating under the blue decal program.

For those that flat our refuse to conform you will be denied moorage in any of the facility's ran by the village of Ucluelet.

As the Blue Decal program is NOT Mandatory (Direct from TC) this ruling is completely unenforceable. Should the Small Craft Harbor deny anyone without the decal access, they are leaving themselves wide open for being sued. Really.

Cheers,
Nog

 

[Hit em Hard]

As the Blue Decal program is NOT Mandatory (Direct from TC) this ruling is completely unenforceable. Should the Small Craft Harbor deny anyone without the decal access, they are leaving themselves wide open for being sued. Really.

Cheers,
Nog

Good to know, Thanks Nog

H.E.H

 

[searun]

Applies only to Charter Operators, not pleasure craft.

Nog, the blue decal program is TC's program, you are correct on that point. Whether they can enforce it or not, who knows, who cares.

All that happened here is TC went to Village of Ucluelet and talked about the program, and made it known to the that this program ensures the guides are safe, and that it potentially limits the liability exposure the Village would have if an operator had an accident. So essentially the Village has now heard they can limit their liability if they ensure all operators buying moorage are TC compliant.

Now that they heard this, they are duty bound to exercise due diligence and make the blue decal part of the terms of buying moorage and in this way limit their liability should an operator have an accident. What they would be doing if they didn't is they would open the liability insurance policy of the Village. It would go down something like this...a lawyer at trial would ask the City Manager if they knew about the blue decal program, and the extra safety steps/qualifications a guide would have to demonstrate to comply. Answer, yes we heard about it. Lawyer would refer City Mgr to their minutes if he couldn't recall that. Next the lawyer would ask the City Manager what advice they heard and what could have been done to limit the risk. Hopefully the City could say in their defense, we made having the TC blue decal part of the moorage agreement - they are then somewhat protected. If however the City decided to ignore this information and simply carry on with not requiring the operators to have blue decal compliance, the lawyer would be jumping for joy, because the City would not have taken steps to act on this information and exercise due diligence - thereby opening up another liability policy from which to collect...because all the plaintiff could get under the guide's policy (assuming they had one is $250K per plaintiff per occurrence).

So you see, it really matters not if the TC program can or will be enforced - what matters is the Village of Ucluelet has to wrestle with the risk they will open up a liability exposure if they do not act on the information they now have from TC. Don't forget, that in the event of a law suit, any plaintiff lawyer worth their salt would be smart enough to call all this into evidence, and a court would be looking for additional insurance money to pay the plaintiff as the law currently limits payouts to $250,000 per person, per incident....but not so if you can bring in another party to pay.

So, good luck getting Ucluelet to change their minds...I'm sure they will consult their corporate lawyers who will paint this same picture and it will be a requirement of moorage.

 

[cheech]

My understanding is that charter operaters have to carry 2 mil (minimum) liability and have a business license to work off the gov't dock. Which is posted at the top of the dock.
What kind of 'accident' other than a slip and fall would the municipality be liable for?

 

[richmake]

Really doesn't matter or not if you think this program is legal or not
Fact is that if your operating commercially on our coast you fall under the guidelines of the Canada Shipping Act.(2001).
If you think any of our vessels would pass all that regulations and procedures your dreaming.
The only option is the blue decal boy's
Simple and free for the most part
Your simply an idiot and irresponsible to not participate at this point as legally one way or another it is your only option professionally.

 

[IronNoggin]

... The only option is the blue decal boy's
Simple and free for the most part Your simply an idiot and irresponsible to not participate at this point as legally one way or another it is your only option professionally.

I wasn't (and am not) arguing that we shouldn't comply with TC and their requirements for boats and operators. There is no choice in this regard, do it or lose it. And of course I am all for safety and liability coverage for what many of us do!

The point I was making is that the Blue Decal Program is NOT mandatory and that as a consequence, the Village of Ucluelet stepping up and saying it is is WELL beyond their bounds. Such a move represents superseding a Federal Ministry, and that simply ain't the way it works. Thus, they leave themselves open to legal challenge should they proceed with this matter. They will do what they will do. But insisting that a voluntary Federal Program is now mandatory in their area of influence opens a legal can of worms they will not like should someone choose to challenge said decision.

Cheers,
Nog

 

[Doug]

Searun is 100% correct with his explanation.

We see legal actions such as this all the time. When an accident happens everyone and their dog is painted with the same brush and then the lawyer start the process of elimination. If there is any liability against anyone, I guaranty you that the legal system will seek compensation.

If you are aware of the issue and it is documented, do your due diligence and try to reduce your liabilities.

The same goes for boat insurance.
If at your place of moorage, your moorage agreement says you must carry $$$ of insurance and the vessel beside you catches fire and destroys your boat, but the boat owner never had insurance and has no money. Guess who the insurance company will seek compensation from. I know the legal system would definitely come after the dock owner for not doing his due diligence in make sure everyone has complied to the moorage agreement he has in place.

This is all common practice in lease agreements.

Liability and appearing to do your due diligence is a big issue. For the past 10 years I've spent more than 10 days in refresher course just dealing with these very issues.


Just look at what DFO is doing with the dam issues. Reducing their liability.

 

[searun]

Thanks Doug, I'm not advocating the merits of the blue decal program. Simply stating the most likely reasons behind the decision. Let's face it, once the Village of Ucluelet heard the information from TC that now forms part of the permanent record (meeting minutes). That places the Village in a conflict if they do not take action. It is the not taking action that would be argued by a smart lawyer as the Village not exercising due diligence to protect guests to their docks. As for liability for an accident, I think Cheech if you go back and read my earlier reply that sets out why a lawyer would try to get at the liability policy of the dock owners - they will turn over every rock to get more than the $250K coverage you are exposed to as a Charter Operator. This is also why the Village is very unlikely to change the policy (or unwise if they do).

Bottom line is there is plenty of time for operators to get compliant with the TC blue decal program now that everyone knows the ground rules. I wouldn't waste a lot of time arguing the point. After all, the Village owns the docks and he who has the gold, makes the rules. No arguments over the legality or not of the blue decal program are going to solve the core problem the Village now faces. And if by some strange turn of events they overturn the decision, they are now inviting a liability exposure - foolish if they do.

 

[Dogbreath]

Very interesting-Thanks to everyone for their contributions.